I have a question. If the machines did build Zion and the machines in it (Second Renaissance you see the machines have a hover craft) then when did that happen? Is that what happens when the one reaches the sourse and chooses the 21 individuals? Is there a time ellaspe so the machines can rebuild Zion? Are the saved humans taught to rebuild Zion?
And heres what really gets me-if the previous one's chose the door to the sourse and saved the individuals why didn't the one tell them what happened? According to morpheous in M1 a man saved the first of them, why couldn't he tell them what was REALLY going on? I mean Morpheous says its closer to 2199, that information and the idea of A.I and the war had to come from somewhere. Maybe theh one saved them and died, but still then how did they know what the hell was going on? Even if they were told "you're the first to be saved from the matrix" they had to wonder where Zion came from and whatnot. Too many questions.
Perhaps the Machines gave the previous Ones help in setting up the technology in Zion. Since they encouraged all the previous Ones to select 23 individuals from the Matrix after it was reloaded each time, it's not implausible that the Machines would want the Zionites to survive after being unplugged. In order to survive, the humans would need basic technology, medical supplies, and so on, at least in the first few years. But since the planet had already been ravaged, and the first freed humans wouldn't have the physical (atrophied muscles) nor intellectual means to build essential technology from scratch, hence it's likely that the Machines gave them a helping hand. Even if the help was indirect (eg. by telling the One where to find pieces of technology left behind, etc.). Someone pointed out in an earlier thread that the hovercrafts were similar to the crafts built by the Machines in 01 as shown in the Second Renaissance of the Animatrix.
Also, I suspect that the previous Zions were not necessarily located at the same place. Maybe the Zion preceding the present one was 20,000 leagues under the sea. If so, when Sentinels went underwater to find Zion, they would have seen sea creatures such as the octopus, squid or jellyfish. I wonder if they mistook them as their kin.
The_Rebel
"The learning and knowledge that we have, is, at the most, but little compared with that of which we are ignorant" - Plato
Well here's the thing right: they can't pull out older people from the Matrix easily, so in my humble opinion, The One is assimilated, chooses some people to get awakened, and the machines nurture them, give them technology, and basically get them started. Thus all the old people in Zion are on the Council and know the true story and lie about how long the culture has been going for and how the One died.
If I'm right, this means a wicked confrontation with the Council members back in Zion. Unlikely though! Gotta love wild conjecture a few hours before the movie!
100 years old though?? I don't think so. Although.. hmm... thinking about it and the way the Council Members acted, that may actually fit....
HECK: Knowledge is not intelligence. The people who are alive 200 years from now will not be more intelligent than we are. You think just because you know calculus that you are as smart as Newton? You know trigonometry that you are as smart as Pythagorus? You understand Shakespeare so you must have the literary genious that he had? You can play Mozart on violin so that makes you a musical genious like Mozart? No, going through the motions is not intelligence. An automated machine can go through the motions. Intelligence is creation, discovery.
Great thread as always, Heck (even if it's 2 years old).
Relevant question now is, are we closer to getting an answer in regard to the question posed by this thread?
The_Rebel
"The learning and knowledge that we have, is, at the most, but little compared with that of which we are ignorant" - Plato
You know Rebel, I don't think we are... oh well. It was the question that drove me here. Funny how a single movie can spawn so much speculation and conversation.
MuffinMcFluffin, yeah, I've become a tad more mouthy in my INR old age...
11-04-2003 10:19 PM
