CAIRO, Egypt - A group calling itself al-Qaida in Palestine posted a Web video Wednesday denouncing those who "work in the service of the Jews."
The 5-minute video contains previously-aired clips of Osama bin Laden and slain al-Qaida in Iraq leader Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, as well as footage of a masked man sitting alongside an automatic weapon and a rocket-propelled grenade launcher.
"My speech is directed against... those who announce blasphemy against Islam and who are allied with enemies of God and religion, and work in the service of the Jews and the Christians," the man said.
It was unclear how large or sophisticated the group was, or whether it was indeed linked to al-Qaida. It has never claimed responsibility for any attacks.
A senior Palestinian security official in Gaza said he had never heard of Abu Hafs and could not confirm or deny the existence of this group.
The video surfaced as U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice held a news conference with Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas in the West Bank.
The man on the video identifies himself as Abu Hafs, a field commander for the group al-Qaida in Palestine. He appeared to criticize Palestinian leaders without naming them, along with Palestinians he viewed as not doing enough for their national cause.
"They own investments, companies and real estate inside and outside the country while the people are starving and without clothes," he said. Big salaries had lured some Palestinians to cooperate with Israel "like a herd of sheep," he said.
Speaking directly to Palestinians, the man said: "In every crisis, your leaders flee abroad and hand you over to killing and horror."
Some Israeli media have reported that al-Qaida was trying to build cells in the Gaza Strip and West Bank, and Israel has indicted two West Bank militants for al-Qaida membership.
The man on the video threatened "a severe war (against) anyone who carries a weapon defending a traitor, an informer or a security coordinator."
"He will be a target for our swords if he does not repent and return to the people's ranks.... Be aware not to accompany them to death," he warned.
The Palestinian security official, speaking on condition of anonymity, said he did not believe there are any Al-Qaida cells present in Gaza, though there may be individuals who sympathize with the group's ideology.
Governor Bush on Kosovo war exit strategy in 99 ” Victory means exit strategy, and it's important for the President to explain to us what the exit strategy is."
President Bush on Iraq war exit strategy from 2003 to 2008. “ “
oneofpeace said this in post #1 : So much for peace...
So much for peace what? You are starting to sound more and more like Curley Joe. So Al Qaeda are trying to set up cells in Palestinian areas? What surprises me is they haven't already tried this a couple of years ago. This may not actually be a welcome move for the majority of Palestinians, just like the majority of Iraqis who do not want anything to do with Al Qaeda. Or do you think otherwise, and this is welcome on your part to fit in with your often expressed "Jihadi" view of Muslims?
Nevertheless, you say “this may not be a welcome move by the Palestinians”? Well lets hope so. I don’t exactly have faith in their choice processes.
If al-Qaeda gets a hold of Palestine, there will be no peace period. In fact, I say with Hamas at the helm of Palestine, if al-Qaeda takes up residence there, there is no other path but all out war in the region, finally.
Personally, I hope the Palestinians are a little brighter than that. However given the images of them celebrating in the streets after al-Qaeda struck on 9/11, well you'll have to pardon me if I have a seed of doubt or two.
Governor Bush on Kosovo war exit strategy in 99 ” Victory means exit strategy, and it's important for the President to explain to us what the exit strategy is."
President Bush on Iraq war exit strategy from 2003 to 2008. “ “
oneofpeace said this in post #3 :
Personally, I hope the Palestinians are a little brighter than that. However given the images of them celebrating in the streets after al-Qaeda struck on 9/11, well you'll have to pardon me if I have a seed of doubt or two.
I was going to take the curley joe comment back but you've jumped right into his area once again - "However given the images of them celebrating in the streets after al-Qaeda struck on 9/11". peace, you do a great disservice to yourself coming out with such asinine comments. "them" - I presume you mean "the Palestinians" - celebrating, was some video of about 5 people dancing in the street. Which was the only video of "celebrating" I saw, and it was this same short video which was shown over and over again ad nauseam.
quote:
Personally, I hope the Palestinians are a little brighter than that.
"The Palestinians", over 5 million of them, may not have a great deal of say in whether Al Qaeda set up some kind of operations in the occupied territories. Just like the US and the Iraqi government don't have a lot of choice whether or not Al Qaeda base themselves in Iraq, or the USA, or Britain etc.
h@ts wrote
I was going to take the curley joe comment back but you've jumped right into his area once again - "However given the images of them celebrating in the streets after al-Qaeda struck on 9/11". peace, you do a great disservice to yourself coming out with such asinine comments. "them" - I presume you mean "the Palestinians" - celebrating, was some video of about 5 people dancing in the street. Which was the only video of "celebrating" I saw, and it was this same short video which was shown over and over again ad nauseam.
What’s nauseating is your continued efforts to be blinded by your prejudices. Five people celebrating? Maybe you only get one channel or that internet of yours doesn’t allow you to see through those jaded glasses you consistently wear. Let’s just hope your computer works with this link I’m posting now.
If that doesn’t seem to work for you, then how about this?
“According to the AP, Israel Radio and the Jerusalem Post, the Palestinians threatened news organizations and their workers in an effort to stop the broadcast of video, and the publishing of photographs, showing large crowds of Palestinians in Nablus and Ramallah joyfully celebrating the deadly 9/11 terrorist attacks against Americans. Presumably they understood that such video and photos would be repugnant to Americans — and millions of others around the world — and might damage their image.” Source
quote:
"The Palestinians", over 5 million of them, may not have a great deal of say in whether Al Qaeda set up some kind of operations in the occupied territories. Just like the US and the Iraqi government don't have a lot of choice whether or not Al Qaeda base themselves in Iraq, or the USA, or Britain etc.
Another jaded remark here. First, al-Qaeda doesn’t exist in the US or Britain like they do in Iraq. Clearly Islamic militants garner much support in Muslim countries from civilians who either share their ideologies or are too scared to protest against them.
If Palestinians want to separate themselves from al-Qaeda, they can do so and lets hope they do. Given the level of violence the world’s seen with Islamic militancy and especially al-Qaeda, for you to blast me for having the perceptions I do seems more than a bit unreasonable.
Governor Bush on Kosovo war exit strategy in 99 ” Victory means exit strategy, and it's important for the President to explain to us what the exit strategy is."
President Bush on Iraq war exit strategy from 2003 to 2008. “ “
oneofpeace said this in post #5 :
[B]What’s nauseating is your continued efforts to be blinded by your prejudices.
Prejudice? It's you that is posting these ludicrous generalisations, showing an inability to reason with any depth anymore, and your constant assertions and implications that lump a whole group of people together as the problem. Prejudiced? You started this post with the inane comment - "So much for peace..."
quote:
Five people celebrating? Maybe you only get one channel or that internet of yours doesn’t allow you to see through those jaded glasses you consistently wear. Let’s just hope your computer works with this link I’m posting now.
Are you claiming that you had access to channels showing "the Palestinians" celebrating after the 9/11 attack? Or did you find these websites recently?
quote:
The September 11, 2001 Terrorist Attack occasioned apparent spontaneous outbreaks of public celebration in a number of Arab Muslim communities. Press and television coverage of these celebrations were met with shock and outrage in the United States. However, later media analysis cast doubt on the motivations and extent of the celebrations, and many Muslim groups moved to distance themselves from such behaviour.
However, the US media did not widely circulate European media reports (by the German weeklies Der Spiegel and Stern, by the German public TV magazine Panorama and by the Swedish Dagens Nyheter) that while the footage was indeed correctly dated, reporters may have partly staged one of the scenes. One woman later claimed she was offered a piece of pie for whooping it up in front of the camera. It is unclear whether it was explained to the woman what she was supposedly celebrating, nor is it clear whether the person who offered her the treat was a reporter.
Considering the history and support US governments give to Israel to buy bombs, planes, tanks, guns etc I am surprised there weren't more people in the occupied territories celebrating the 9/11 attacks.
h@ts wrote
Prejudice? It's you that is posting these ludicrous generalisations, showing an inability to reason with any depth anymore, ……..You started this post with the inane comment - "So much for peace..."
h@ts were talking abou al Qaeda here. Since when have they ever been equivocated with peace?
My point was if they have succeeded in infiltrating into Palestine, it will be the beginning of WWIII. If you think this is generalizations of Palestinians, then so be it however if they accept al-Qaeda like they do Hamas, Islamic Jihad, Brigade and the rest of them, then there will be NO PEACE POSSIBLE EVER!!!
quote:
Are you claiming that you had access to channels showing "the Palestinians" celebrating after the 9/11 attack? Or did you find these websites recently?
No, what I’m saying is that the day of 9/11, I saw large crowds of Palestinians on TV celebrating with dancing in the streets. Certainly there were more than 5 and Arafat said on that day he condemned the act. Then suddenly there was a blackout of Palestinian areas.
You do the math.
quote:
Considering the history and support US governments give to Israel to buy bombs, planes, tanks, guns etc I am surprised there weren't more people in the occupied territories celebrating the 9/11 attacks.
I really don’t think I need to reply to this. I now know why you subscribe to so many ridiculous positions in these forums.
Governor Bush on Kosovo war exit strategy in 99 ” Victory means exit strategy, and it's important for the President to explain to us what the exit strategy is."
President Bush on Iraq war exit strategy from 2003 to 2008. “ “
h@ts: Considering the history and support US governments give to Israel to buy bombs, planes, tanks, guns etc I am surprised there weren't more people in the occupied territories celebrating the 9/11 attacks.
oneofpeace:I really don’t think I need to reply to this. I now know why you subscribe to so many ridiculous positions in these forums.
Please do reply to it. You brought up the idea about "them", "the Palestinians" "celebrating in the streets after al-Qaeda struck on 9/11", in a post that started off with the comment - "So much for peace..."
Did or didn't it surprise you that as you said "the Palestinians" were "celebrating" the 9/11 attack?
And why do you think you "now know" why I "subscribe to so many ridiculous positions in these forums"?
Al Quedia in Palestine is nothing at all it's probably one of two things either a bunch of jumped up terrorisst who don't have the intelligence, money, men or weapons to carry out an attack but will jump on Al Queida coattails to gain fear and recognition or it's a sleeper cell like Al Queida in the UK, America or Egypt the group will carry out an attack and the vanish for a few years.
Whatever it is it will struggle for volunteers as many Muslims in the area have seen Al Quieda for what is which is nothing more than a terror group that but when Palestinians see groups like Hamas military wing and Al Axa Martyrs Brigade they see freedom fighters and that is more attractive to them.
lodgebo said this in post #9 : Al Quieda for what is which is nothing more than a terror group that but when Palestinians see groups like Hamas military wing and Al Axa Martyrs Brigade they see freedom fighters and that is more attractive to them.
A good point. Lumping all terrorist organisations into one neat group is the way politicians want the public to see the problem. Al Aksa Martyr Brigade are a secular group - why would they want anything to do with a militant Islamic fundamentalist group like Al Qaeda.
Al Qaeda are not welcome in countries like Iran either (Al Qaeda are Sunni, Iran is mainly Shia) and Iran backs Hamas, so Al Qaeda can't just easily walk into the occupied territories and say hi, we've come to help out.
A good point. Lumping all terrorist organisations into one neat group is the way politicians want the public to see the problem. Al Aksa Martyr Brigade are a secular group - why would they want anything to do with a militant Islamic fundamentalist group like Al Qaeda.
Al Qaeda are not welcome in countries like Iran either (Al Qaeda are Sunni, Iran is mainly Shia) and Iran backs Hamas, so Al Qaeda can't just easily walk into the occupied territories and say hi, we've come to help out.
Well half his point was good, the part you didn't quote.
Hamas, which is now in power, *is* a fundamenalist religous group. Moreover, the views of Hamas, AMB and Al Quaeda with respect to the "Zionist question" are in total lockstep. There is zero disagreement on the ultiamte objective, even if they do sometimes disagree about what measures to pursue at a given moment in time. And Al Quaeda's other major grievance had to do with the Gulf War. Since better than 85% of the total population of the Arab world was against U.S. intervention, I'd be surprised if the Palestinians were some kind of special case there, and not also in lockstep with Al Quaeda on that issue as well.
Interesting bit of sophistry that you choose to mention AMB and not Hamas in making your point. Anyway, Al-Aksa Martyr Brigades is hardly an organization that is secular in principle or core philosophy, in spite of their association with Fatah, a political party. That's like saying the extreme right orthodox parties in Israel are secular because they form themselves into political parties and run for election. Al-Aksa, BTW, is a *mosque* that sits on the temple mount in Jerusalem, and a martyr, in Islamic lexicon, is one who gives his life in service of Jihad. AMB had people blowing themselves up, k? And they weren't going to do that without some promise of Reward afterwords. People might risk their lives for purely political causes, but generally they don't commit suicide without there being a strong spiritual component.
One could suppose that Palestinians support the detonation of bombs in bus stations and restaurants in Israel, but not the flying of commercial aircraft into skyscrapers in New York. But after all, the difference is merely one of quantity, not quality. Anyway, I think the large scale celebrations of the 9/11 event which quite clearly were depicted on television at the time suggest otherwise, at least for a portion of the Palestinian population.
That said, I think the rest of lodgebo's post was probably correct. Al Quaeda is not the centralized organization that people think it is. It's really just an umbrella, and it is already tied to regional terrorist groups. Hence, in a sense, having "Al Quaeda" there isn't anything new and probably isn't a sign of anything new to come. All Al Quaeda really is is a globalization of more regionally focused Islamic terror groups. And it isn't much of an organization in and of itself - it's more of a group that coordinates existing groups.
- woolfe
The best lack all conviction, while the worst are filled with passionate intensity.
Well half his point was good, the part you didn't quote.
Hamas, which is now in power, *is* a fundamenalist religous group. Moreover, the views of Hamas, AMB and Al Quaeda with respect to the "Zionist question" are in total lockstep. There is zero disagreement on the ultiamte objective, even if they do sometimes disagree about what measures to pursue at a given moment in time. And Al Quaeda's other major grievance had to do with the Gulf War. Since better than 85% of the total population of the Arab world was against U.S. intervention, I'd be surprised if the Palestinians were some kind of special case there, and not also in lockstep with Al Quaeda on that issue as well.
Interesting bit of sophistry that you choose to mention AMB and not Hamas in making your point. Anyway, Al-Aksa Martyr Brigades is hardly an organization that is secular in principle or core philosophy, in spite of their association with Fatah, a political party. That's like saying the extreme right orthodox parties in Israel are secular because they form themselves into political parties and run for election. Al-Aksa, BTW, is a *mosque* that sits on the temple mount in Jerusalem, and a martyr, in Islamic lexicon, is one who gives his life in service of Jihad. AMB had people blowing themselves up, k? And they weren't going to do that without some promise of Reward afterwords. People might risk their lives for purely political causes, but generally they don't commit suicide without there being a strong spiritual component.
One could suppose that Palestinians support the detonation of bombs in bus stations and restaurants in Israel, but not the flying of commercial aircraft into skyscrapers in New York. But after all, the difference is merely one of quantity, not quality. Anyway, I think the large scale celebrations of the 9/11 event which quite clearly were depicted on television at the time suggest otherwise, at least for a portion of the Palestinian population.
That said, I think the rest of lodgebo's post was probably correct. Al Quaeda is not the centralized organization that people think it is. It's really just an umbrella, and it is already tied to regional terrorist groups. Hence, in a sense, having "Al Quaeda" there isn't anything new and probably isn't a sign of anything new to come. All Al Quaeda really is is a globalization of more regionally focused Islamic terror groups. And it isn't much of an organization in and of itself - it's more of a group that coordinates existing groups.
- woolfe
If you want to simplify the conflict and the groups involved that's your choice. Do you think that makes it easier to understand or easier to push a certain agenda, whatever that might be?
AQ is becoming a moniker for all things terrorist. I have no doubt offshoot or rag tag wannabe's are using the name to gain support or foster their martyrdom. On the flip side, any and all terrorist action can be labeled as AQ by the U.S. or Britian and treated accordingly. Shades of the Red Scare back in the day.
I agree Heck with what you say here but the actions of Islamic militants are eerily similar. AQ wouldn’t approach the boy scouts trying to recruit them for their cause but rather another group who has similar agendas and tactics as theirs.
In the grand scheme of things, although groups like Hamas and AMB really doesn’t want to be associated with AQ because of obvious reasons, I wouldn’t be surprised that if someday AQ ends up residing in Palestine because it’s not really that far fetched.
Governor Bush on Kosovo war exit strategy in 99 ” Victory means exit strategy, and it's important for the President to explain to us what the exit strategy is."
President Bush on Iraq war exit strategy from 2003 to 2008. “ “
And you know the return of the Taliban in Afghanistan (something the administration and the Dubyanauts don't wanna talk about) would harbor every freak show group wanting to call themselves AQ. Horrible.
10-04-2006 07:59 PM
