I think Snape is on Dumbledore's side. What if Dumbledore required an Unbreakable Vow from Snape when he joined the staff? He could have required him to vow that he would NEVER seek to kill Harry. That could be true.
As I already stated in another thread, I think he is on his own side. He chooses the side that seems to help him the most and then manages to fool both of them thanks to his mastery of the dark arts as well as occlumency.
M.
"Every positive integer is one of Ramanujan's personal friends."—J. E. Littlewood.
If he was so selfish and self-serving, why would Snape bother making a vow risking his life just to save Malfoy? If he was looking out for only himself, why would he have taken up a possition to go up against Albus Dumbledore himself? Perhaps you could say he was looking to take the glory for his own, but if that were true, why wouldn't he have let Dumbledore die when he had the Horcrux ring? It just doesn't make sense to me that he would be on only his own side. I think Slughorn was more self-serving then Snape ever was.
I think he is either on one side or the other. Good or bad, he is a brilliant liar and minipulator.
But it even goes to say, that even in the bitter end Dumbledore seemed to believe in him. Was Dumbledore pleading with Snape to not kill him? Or was he pleading with him to save himself and kill him because it was what Snape needed to do? Maybe it was what Snape needed to hear even.
If you remember, Dumbledore even had this mentality with Harry, before taking them to Voldemort's cave. He made Harry promise to do whatever he said once they got there and that if Harry needed to leave him behind and save himself, to do so.
Dumbledore was a trusting man, but he was no fool. I think Dumbledore was used to giving orders to people, which others didn't like to take. Like sending Snape back as a D.E., or Lupin back to Greyback, or even making Harry go back to the Dursley's.
On the other hand I think Snape was good at taking those orders, doing what needed to be done (without flinching if need be), perhaps even damning himself in the end for the the good of everyone. How can Voldemort doubt him now?
On another note (I said this bit in the the Horcrux Thread): Why would Dumbledore put Snape in the DADA possition when he KNEW that Voldemort had cursed it. WHY knowing that Snape would eventually be booted out by the curse and leave Hogwarts? This is what I would really like to know. ANY IDEAS? I have not seen anyone else comment on this.
In a nutshell, I still believe Snape is good and only the words of J.K. will dissuade me otherwise. :P (Stubborn till the bitter end, I am. And besides... I love a good conspiracy theory!)
V. S. Black said this in post #8 : If he was so selfish and self-serving, why would Snape bother making a vow risking his life just to save Malfoy? If he was looking out for only himself, why would he have taken up a possition to go up against Albus Dumbledore himself? Perhaps you could say he was looking to take the glory for his own, but if that were true, why wouldn't he have let Dumbledore die when he had the Horcrux ring? It just doesn't make sense to me that he would be on only his own side. I think Slughorn was more self-serving then Snape ever was.
Snape only made the vow because if he didnt the two sisters would go to there master and say, and he would look very sus. And i also think he has a liking for malfoy.
If he had let dumbledore down (die) with the ring is he would look like a traitor for the good side (him being an expert on potions) on the slim chance he would servive if he didnt help, a chance he didnt want to take.
I agree that Slughorn is out for number 1 alone, like lockhart
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I think he is either on one side or the other. Good or bad, he is a brilliant liar and minipulator.
But it even goes to say, that even in the bitter end Dumbledore seemed to believe in him. Was Dumbledore pleading with Snape to not kill him? Or was he pleading with him to save himself and kill him because it was what Snape needed to do? Maybe it was what Snape needed to hear even.
or maybe he was pleading for him to kill and keep malfoy from becomeing a murderer, he had almost perswaded him to turn to the good side.
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If you remember, Dumbledore even had this mentality with Harry, before taking them to Voldemort's cave. He made Harry promise to do whatever he said once they got there and that if Harry needed to leave him behind and save himself, to do so.
These actions before they went to the cave made me suspect Dumbledore was better at Divination that he had let on.
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Dumbledore was a trusting man, but he was no fool. I think Dumbledore was used to giving orders to people, which others didn't like to take. Like sending Snape back as a D.E., or Lupin back to Greyback, or even making Harry go back to the Dursley's.
He knew that it was for the best, Harry's charm would still work if he went to the dudley's once a year (protection), He needed a spy in the warewolves, and although Lupin didnt like the job it was better than makeing someone else a warewolf, and snape leading a double agent life brought it on himself ... he knew that Voldemort would kill snape if he didnt go back (not such a bad thing now though, ay)
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On the other hand I think Snape was good at taking those orders, doing what needed to be done (without flinching if need be), perhaps even damning himself in the end for the the good of everyone. How can Voldemort doubt him now?
Snape was very good at gain trust back in both Dumbledore and Voldemort
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On another note (I said this bit in the the Horcrux Thread): Why would Dumbledore put Snape in the DADA possition when he KNEW that Voldemort had cursed it. WHY knowing that Snape would eventually be booted out by the curse and leave Hogwarts? This is what I would really like to know. ANY IDEAS? I have not seen anyone else comment on this.
Perhaps Dumbledore thought that maybe snape wouldn't leave the school after the year, but perhaps go back to his (uncursed) potions job. but who knows
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In a nutshell, I still believe Snape is good and only the words of J.K. will dissuade me otherwise. :P (Stubborn till the bitter end, I am. And besides... I love a good conspiracy theory!)
He ran off with the DE's! killed Dumbledore (albe it under a vow) and has betraid the good side many times ...
On another note (I said this bit in the the Horcrux Thread): Why would Dumbledore put Snape in the DADA possition when he KNEW that Voldemort had cursed it. WHY knowing that Snape would eventually be booted out by the curse and leave Hogwarts? This is what I would really like to know. ANY IDEAS? I have not seen anyone else comment on this.
Two reasons.
1. Harry could not continue his training in hope of being an auror one day if Snape remained potions master.
2. Slughorn was needed. Dumbledore suspected that there was a horcrux, but he needed Slughorn to give him the proof. Proof that only Harry could get. What better way than to put the man in the school and have the lure of Harry Potter becoming one of his favorites as Lilly had been?
A question about Snape now. Did anyone else wonder why it was Lilly that was always mentioned as Slughorns outstanding student and not Snape?
Oh, and the Unbreakable Vow. I believe that you would be bound by the first vow. A conflicting vow would be cancelled out and you would have to honor the original vow.
Dumbledore did not put much stock in Divination. He just knew his opponent. As for Snape at the end of the book, of course he would take pleasure in taunting Harry. Harry=James to him. He can not help but hate the boy. Snape's weakness is his hatred.
Fuscia, I would personally think that the two unbreakable vows that contradict each other would both stand, therefore, no matter what you do, you're dead.
I believe Snape is on his own side. He does seem to have loyalty to Voldemort, however he has his own visions of grandeur that you know have nothing to do with the Dark Lord.
I think if Slughorn had mentioned Snape as his finest student (from JKR's point of view), people would have guessed him as the Half Blood Prince, so she kept quiet. Though to be honest, I guessed it as soon as I saw it was written in a potions text book.
"I'm for it so we can put Nuclear power plants up there, and then beam the power back to earth on a laser beam." ~ Whidden
gaboman said this in post #11 : Fuscia, I would personally think that the two unbreakable vows that contradict each other would both stand, therefore, no matter what you do, you're dead.boy would that suck!
I believe Snape is on his own side. He does seem to have loyalty to Voldemort, however he has his own visions of grandeur that you know have nothing to do with the Dark Lord.
I think his vision is to eclipse Sirius, James and Harry. He must be the bigger man, the stronger one .....
I think if Slughorn had mentioned Snape as his finest student (from JKR's point of view), people would have guessed him as the Half Blood Prince, so she kept quiet. Though to be honest, I guessed it as soon as I saw it was written in a potions text book.
Still, he could have been brilliant at potions, and still not in the Slug Club. Maybe Lilly really was better at potions than Snape. She was head girl, and James not Severus was Head boy.
Ya, well, Severus was never gonna be head boy. He was a bit of a loser from what I could see. I would think the Head Boy would be someone the other kids look up to.
"I'm for it so we can put Nuclear power plants up there, and then beam the power back to earth on a laser beam." ~ Whidden
07-18-2005 07:12 PM
