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mystic
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post #121  quote:

quote:
h@ts said this in post #120 :


I said regardless of her intention to screw this guy and his family, she has screwed him and his family over very well. You don't agree?

In Madonna's blundering wake we have a man who denies giving her his baby for adoption, accusations the family is infected with the AIDS virus, a family accused of neglecting and abandoning a child, and then there's the orphanage accused of lying, who in turn accuse government officials of lying.


No, I dont agree either way. I dont have enough information to place a judgment on any party. Everything I have read in the past few years on just about any subject I have taken with a grain of salt. If nothing else, at least thats been proven time and time again.

(Is the news right or wrong in this case? Thats for you to judge...or Im sorry, you already have).


Old Post 10-30-2006 12:20 AM
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post #122  quote:

quote:
mystic said this in post #121 :


No, I dont agree either way. I dont have enough information to place a judgment on any party. Everything I have read in the past few years on just about any subject I have taken with a grain of salt. If nothing else, at least thats been proven time and time again.

(Is the news right or wrong in this case? Thats for you to judge...or Im sorry, you already have).


We all have access to the same information. We've all heard what Madonna said on Oprah (and saying the babies mother and siblings died of AIDS was ignorant and insensitive). We've heard what the babies father said, and what the babies grandparents, and what the orphanage said. There's a lot of contradictory comments flying about.

Thing is, this is just a debate. What's the point of sitting on the fence? If you don't care about the debate then that's a valid stance: the story is hardly earth shattering.


Old Post 10-30-2006 11:00 AM
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post #123  quote:

quote:
h@ts said this in post #122 :


We all have access to the same information. We've all heard what Madonna said on Oprah (and saying the babies mother and siblings died of AIDS was ignorant and insensitive). We've heard what the babies father said, and what the babies grandparents, and what the orphanage said. There's a lot of contradictory comments flying about.

Thing is, this is just a debate. What's the point of sitting on the fence? If you don't care about the debate then that's a valid stance: the story is hardly earth shattering.


Correct. we do all have the same info...question is, how accurate is this info? Fact remains that if she was given this story by whomever then this is what she has to work with, and we cannot fault her if she was given false info. Stories keep changing. So does this mean opinons change as the stories change? How frustrating is that? I would prefer to wait until I get the complete facts and know that this is final until I make a firm opinion one way or the other.

Until then...the story is not earth shattering. Truth be known that this kid is living in an orphange. If he was not eligible for adoption why is he there? Its a question that should not be dismissed.

Agreed about the debate stance...the problem I have is that people are debating without info...and how can anyone really have a successful debate without the real truth?


Old Post 10-30-2006 09:38 PM
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post #124  quote:

The thing is if Madonna now knows that the whole AIDs this is wrong why not apologise at the end of the day it is the boys father she is insulting and also his dead mother a simple apology or admiiting she got it wrong would not be so hard that's wht her publicist and PR people are for/

As for what the boy was doing in Malawi well thats simple a lot of people in Malawi put thier kids in orpahnages because they can't afford to look after them normally they go back and collect the child when things have got better. In some cases kids get fostered off but in most cases they stay in the orphnages until things pick up.


Old Post 10-30-2006 10:52 PM
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post #125  quote:

quote:
Lawless said this in post #109 :



I love when you do your drunk posting! Entertainment at it's finest!


Man, don't remember that one.

-HECK!


Old Post 10-30-2006 11:05 PM
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post #126  quote:

"Meanwhile, although David has been in the UK for less than two weeks, Madonna has introduced him to her Kabbalah faith.

The move is likely to upset Mr Banda, who was told his son was going to "a very nice Christian lady".

Man, she's many things but a very nice Christian lady, I don't think so

-HECK!


Old Post 10-30-2006 11:08 PM
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post #127  quote:

quote:
lodgebo said this in post #124 :
The thing is if Madonna now knows that the whole AIDs this is wrong why not apologise at the end of the day it is the boys father she is insulting and also his dead mother a simple apology or admiiting she got it wrong would not be so hard that's wht her publicist and PR people are for/

As for what the boy was doing in Malawi well thats simple a lot of people in Malawi put thier kids in orpahnages because they can't afford to look after them normally they go back and collect the child when things have got better. In some cases kids get fostered off but in most cases they stay in the orphnages until things pick up.


Okay...who does she owe an apology to? You? C'mon Lodge...she owes nothing to any of us...and again, if this is new news to her, then what? Do we even know if this is true? Do you have the autopsy results? Again, taking things before the real facts are known? I never thought you to be so judgmental before knowing the actual truth.

As for the kid being in an orphanage....he may have been there because the father could not afford him...the issue still remains that the orphanage listed him as adoptable....why place blame on her when this could be the fault of the country that put him in this position, thus putting Madonna (which could have been anyone) in this position.

Lodge..you are too quick to point fingers before knowing the truth. I think its important that the truth be known first. Do you not feel that is important? Don't we have enough people judging irrationally in this world? Why dont we as people stop placing blame and putting high morals on others when we ourselves have our own faults to live with? Think about it.


Old Post 10-30-2006 11:11 PM
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post #128  quote:

[QUOTE]mystic said this in post #127 :
[B]

Okay...who does she owe an apology to? You? C'mon Lodge...she owes nothing to any of us...and again, if this is new news to her, then what? Do we even know if this is true? Do you have the autopsy results? Again, taking things before the real facts are known? I never thought you to be so judgmental before knowing the actual truth.

This is the truth even Madonna's people have admitted she got it wrong, also medical sciencie would tell you that if the father and mother and sister had AIDs then David would have it as well. So like I said an apology or admitting she got it wrong would be the right thing to do, try thinking long term what happens when David reaches 18 and hears that his adoptive mother accused his whole family of having AIDs and then pretnded it did not happen, that is going to be hard for anybody to accept. How would you feel if somebody came out and claimed your parents had AIDs would you be cool with that or not? because that is the same issue this boy is going to face sooner or later.

As for the kid being in an orphanage....he may have been there because the father could not afford him...the issue still remains that the orphanage listed him as adoptable....why place blame on her when this could be the fault of the country that put him in this position, thus putting Madonna (which could have been anyone) in this position.

Oh and I assume you have seen the adoption papers that the orpahange had right? for soemone who is quick to jump down my throat and tell me to wait for facts you don't seem adverse to making assumptions.


Old Post 10-31-2006 01:26 AM
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post #129  quote:

[B]
quote:
lodgebo said this in post #128 :

This is the truth even Madonna's people have admitted she got it wrong, also medical sciencie would tell you that if the father and mother and sister had AIDs then David would have it as well. So like I said an apology or admitting she got it wrong would be the right thing to do, try thinking long term what happens when David reaches 18 and hears that his adoptive mother accused his whole family of having AIDs and then pretnded it did not happen, that is going to be hard for anybody to accept. How would you feel if somebody came out and claimed your parents had AIDs would you be cool with that or not? because that is the same issue this boy is going to face sooner or later.[/COLOR]

Lodgebo...you might want to check your medical history. Not all infected parents give their birth children AIDS. Why am I not surprised that you would not find out the facts about this before speaking. Look at the CDC, they wil tell you the percentage. True, they are high...but not 100% as you would note.


Oh and I assume you have seen the adoption papers that the orpahange had right? for soemone who is quick to jump down my throat and tell me to wait for facts you don't seem adverse to making assumptions.

He was adoptable according to the courts via the orphange. He was listed on the adoptable list......that much we do know.

Geez Lodgebo....common sense dude.


Old Post 10-31-2006 02:01 AM
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post #130  quote:

quote:
mystic said this in post #129 :
[B]


You know arguing over tahe AIDs thing is pointless because his mother did not die of AIDs ( in Malawi I would bet Malaria) but like you admit if a mother and sister have it the odds he might have it are very high in the mid to high 90s it's actually higher than in the west because we have drugs that can go some way to prevent mother to foetus transmission. So it would be difficult to find olut exactly what Malwian doctors can do for infected mothers.

I notice you still avoid my point though which is how David is going to fell when he finds out his adoptive mother said these things about his biological mother and did not bother to retract the point when she was proved wrong. Again I would ask you how would you fell if somebody had made claims like that aginst your parents?

How do you know he was adoptiable who told you where you there at the time? you are the one that says we must deal in facts and we should not be led by the media so how do you know 100% that he was on the adoptable list?


Old Post 10-31-2006 12:13 PM
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post #131  quote:

quote:
lodgebo said this in post #130 :


You know arguing over tahe AIDs thing is pointless because his mother did not die of AIDs ( in Malawi I would bet Malaria) but like you admit if a mother and sister have it the odds he might have it are very high in the mid to high 90s it's actually higher than in the west because we have drugs that can go some way to prevent mother to foetus transmission. So it would be difficult to find olut exactly what Malwian doctors can do for infected mothers.

I notice you still avoid my point though which is how David is going to fell when he finds out his adoptive mother said these things about his biological mother and did not bother to retract the point when she was proved wrong. Again I would ask you how would you fell if somebody had made claims like that aginst your parents?

How do you know he was adoptiable who told you where you there at the time? you are the one that says we must deal in facts and we should not be led by the media so how do you know 100% that he was on the adoptable list?



He was adoptable accoring to the orphanage...how do you think he got in the court system to begin with????? Again, common sense.

I dont know how he would FEEL. Last time I remembered, I was not David. We all react differently to different things, which is obvious by this case alone.

Malaria...maybe, maybe not...got the autopsy results handy? Another assumption? For that matter, maybe she died of bleeding too much from child birth...

Maybe she died from complete boredom of arguing with someone who says the same things over and over again and then changes a story when he decides to really look for the truth. (POSTED BY LODGE: i.e. also medical sciencie would tell you that if the father and mother and sister had AIDs then David would have it as well.). Glad you looked up the truth after I pointed you where to go Lodge...problem is that you speak first and look later. Thats becomes boring to people who are debating with you.



Old Post 10-31-2006 08:00 PM
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post #132  quote:

[QUOTE]mystic said this in post #131 :
[B]


He was adoptable accoring to the orphanage...how do you think he got in the court system to begin with????? Again, common sense.

So are we assuming that an orphange that would have had little or no records system and that has hundreds of diffrent kids in there for either fostering or adoption could not have made a mistake. Common sense would tell that the way these places are run mistakes are made more often than not. There no IT systems where they could punch up his file and see if it was marked adoption or fostering, there are no individual case wrokers hell there are even no lawyers so maybe a mistake was made.

I dont know how he would FEEL. Last time I remembered, I was not David. We all react differently to different things, which is obvious by this case alone.

Well I asked how YOU would fell not to imagine how he would feel.

Malaria...maybe, maybe not...got the autopsy results handy? Another assumption? For that matter, maybe she died of bleeding too much from child birth...

Maybe but the two biggest killers in Malwi are AID's and Malaria chances are if one did not get here the other would.

Maybe she died from complete boredom of arguing with someone who says the same things over and over again and then changes a story when he decides to really look for the truth. (POSTED BY LODGE: i.e. also medical sciencie would tell you that if the father and mother and sister had AIDs then David would have it as well.). Glad you looked up the truth after I pointed you where to go Lodge...problem is that you speak first and look later. Thats becomes boring to people who are debating with you.

Well don't debate with me leave if I bore you so much leave nobody is making you come here, maybe you are obsessed with me I can't blame you I am very loveable. As for the AID's thing let me repeat myself ( apprently I do that a lot) like I said I was playing the numbers game. You admitted it yourself that the odds of a kid contracting AID's from a parent is high so I was going by the odds. I am only playing the gane your way you know know no listening to the media or making assumptions so I ahd to revert to using numbers


Old Post 11-01-2006 12:37 AM
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post #133  quote:

quote:
lodgebo said this in post #132 :

So are we assuming that an orphange that would have had little or no records system and that has hundreds of diffrent kids in there for either fostering or adoption could not have made a mistake. Common sense would tell that the way these places are run mistakes are made more often than not. There no IT systems where they could punch up his file and see if it was marked adoption or fostering, there are no individual case wrokers hell there are even no lawyers so maybe a mistake was made.

Well I asked how YOU would fell not to imagine how he would feel.

Malaria...maybe, maybe not...got the autopsy results handy? Another assumption? For that matter, maybe she died of bleeding too much from child birth...

Maybe but the two biggest killers in Malwi are AID's and Malaria chances are if one did not get here the other would.

Maybe she died from complete boredom of arguing with someone who says the same things over and over again and then changes a story when he decides to really look for the truth. (POSTED BY LODGE: i.e. also medical sciencie would tell you that if the father and mother and sister had AIDs then David would have it as well.). Glad you looked up the truth after I pointed you where to go Lodge...problem is that you speak first and look later. Thats becomes boring to people who are debating with you.

Well don't debate with me leave if I bore you so much leave nobody is making you come here, maybe you are obsessed with me I can't blame you I am very loveable. As for the AID's thing let me repeat myself ( apprently I do that a lot) like I said I was playing the numbers game. You admitted it yourself that the odds of a kid contracting AID's from a parent is high so I was going by the odds. I am only playing the gane your way you know know no listening to the media or making assumptions so I ahd to revert to using numbers


What you said is that medical science would prove that he would have AIDS if his parents had it....and this is just not the case as medical science has already proved that not all kids contract it through childbirth..but okay, if you are changing your story.....

How would I feel.....well, again, I dont know...I dont know his circumstances, and if he stays in that country, I dont know if the issue is that upfront. See, you ask me how I would feel...but I cannot answer that because my life is different than his. What I might answer might be completely different than his response. So I dont think it would be fair to have my response because I am a completely different person with a completely different life. For example: I might say that one way of living is okay, when another person might say its wrong....you cant ask a person to respond to how someone would feel. You ask me how I would feel...but my answer doesnt' apply.

As for you being loveable...nah. I find you more humerous that you would be judgmental without gathering any facts first. Boring, true...but funny.


Old Post 11-01-2006 02:43 AM
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post #134  quote:

quote:
mystic said this in post #133 :


What you said is that medical science would prove that he would have AIDS if his parents had it....and this is just not the case as medical science has already proved that not all kids contract it through childbirth..but okay, if you are changing your story.....


Whether or not David's family had AIDS, Madonna went on American TV and stated the mother and siblings of David had AIDS and died of the disease.

Medical records are supposed to be secret, but here we have one of the richest pop stars in the world thinking it's okay to give out to the whole world the medical details of a family she hardly knows. She's an ignorant insensitive clot to say the least. But that's hardly a crime.


Old Post 11-01-2006 09:00 AM
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post #135  quote:

Mystic doe yourself a fvour and read post 130 again and you will see that I explained that I said that if a mother and ssiter have it then there is averty high chance that he might have it. So yeah I kind of changed my story but just once how you come to the conclusin that I keep changing my stroy all time is a suprise to me.

You see I am not asking you to put yourself in a third world country or anything that is pointless because this boy does not live in a third world country ( according to Madonna he could have) he lives in the west now and all I wanted was you to ask how you would fell and yet you can't or won't answer. You see your answer does apply because I would say that unless somebody is devoid of emotion they are going to get very upset and angry about anybody saying such terrible things about thier late parents, I know my mum and dad do not have a very high opinion of my parents but they don't say anything around me and my brother because they know he would get upset and fot the same reason Madonna should not have said these things or she should at leastvretract her staement because at some pint he is going to hear what she said.

Ah see you find me funny I am breaking you down in about 4 weeks I will be loveable and in 7 months from now you will find me as adorbale as a puppy.


Old Post 11-01-2006 10:46 AM
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post #136  quote:

I don't know if this is in anyone's earlier posts but....

I saw madonna on the today show this morning and she said that once the orphanage found the father (b/c i guess they had no idea where he was for about a year or something...) i guess madonna went to visit him and offered him money so that HE can take care of his child and that he said no, he wouldn't accept that.

um. what? the father said no.... does anyone else buy that? Even Meredith was like..."he said nooooo?" hmmmmm, i don't believe it. Has anyone heard this? or heard why he decided not to take her money to take care of his own child IF IT'S TRUE? (which i don't believe for 1 second...)


Old Post 11-01-2006 06:53 PM
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post #137  quote:

I saw this she made that claim on a UK show called newsnight that is on here tonight. It makes no sense what she is saying is that she offered the father money to look after David and he refused then he claims he wants his son back which is what he could have had in the first place I cant figure that one out. There is actually a lot in this newsnight interview well a lot has been leaked. In the interview Madonna claims that David's grandmother was dead the interviewer corrects her and Madonna claims well I never met her, which would make me dead as well I guess. There are also claims that David's father claims that he had already agreed a foster link with another US family but I doubt that very much it's just to far out after so much has gone on.

Old Post 11-01-2006 07:06 PM
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post #138  quote:

You know, maybe she should just give the kid back and adopt another one... who's parents are deceased, and no one wants. Then, we can all get past this controversy, and move on with our lives.

Old Post 11-01-2006 07:59 PM
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post #139  quote:

quote:
Lawless said this in post #138 :
You know, maybe she should just give the kid back and adopt another one... who's parents are deceased, and no one wants. Then, we can all get past this controversy, and move on with our lives.


The dad doesn't want the kid back. THat's what I heard anyway.


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post #140  quote:

If he doesn't WANT the kid back, then they need to just move on, and leave things alone. Sheesh, who knew that a person trying to do something good, by taking a child out of a poor living situation, and give them a much better life, would end up being like this.

Makes me so glad that I'm not famous... because I would be pissing the world off, left and right.


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post #141  quote:

Well, I heard that the dad said the kid told him he atcually switched places with another kid who looked like him and now they want to both be adopted by Madonna, but the second kid was accidentally adopted by Sheena Easton.

-HECK!


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post #142  quote:



Old Post 11-01-2006 08:14 PM
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post #143  quote:

Sheena Easton? now THAT'S a poor kid - unless he time traveled to 1984.

Old Post 11-01-2006 11:48 PM
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post #144  quote:

quote:
h@ts said this in post #134 :


Whether or not David's family had AIDS, Madonna went on American TV and stated the mother and siblings of David had AIDS and died of the disease.

Medical records are supposed to be secret, but here we have one of the richest pop stars in the world thinking it's okay to give out to the whole world the medical details of a family she hardly knows. She's an ignorant insensitive clot to say the least. But that's hardly a crime.


Do you have any idea how many autopsy results are out there that are supposed to be secret? That argument doesnt do much when realistically, these things are not as secret as you would think.


Old Post 11-02-2006 05:09 AM
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post #145  quote:

quote:
lodgebo said this in post #135 :
Mystic doe yourself a fvour and read post 130 again and you will see that I explained that I said that if a mother and ssiter have it then there is averty high chance that he might have it. So yeah I kind of changed my story but just once how you come to the conclusin that I keep changing my stroy all time is a suprise to me.

Ah see you find me funny I am breaking you down in about 4 weeks I will be loveable and in 7 months from now you will find me as adorbale as a puppy.


I do find you as adorable as a puppy....one of those that no one wants...but adorable nonetheless.


Old Post 11-02-2006 05:12 AM
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post #146  quote:

quote:
Lawless said this in post #140 :
If he doesn't WANT the kid back, then they need to just move on, and leave things alone. Sheesh, who knew that a person trying to do something good, by taking a child out of a poor living situation, and give them a much better life, would end up being like this.

Makes me so glad that I'm not famous... because I would be pissing the world off, left and right.


C'mon Kris...havent you heard??? She wasnt trying to good...she had an agenda. She made up stories, she is a liar, she was never told any false info, she picked the only kid she could with a dad and family and offered money to them hoping for this one kid because she could not find any other unwanted child in that country. She stole medical info, and she is trying to illegally buy this kid. No one else did wrong...only she did.

Geesh, havent you read anything from the Lodgebo newspaper???


Old Post 11-02-2006 05:18 AM
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post #147  quote:

quote:
mystic said this in post #144 :


Do you have any idea how many autopsy results are out there that are supposed to be secret? That argument doesnt do much when realistically, these things are not as secret as you would think.


If you can say it wouldn't bother you if Madonna went on American TV and started discussing your families medical records, then that's cool. No argument.


Old Post 11-02-2006 09:05 AM
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post #148  quote:

[QUOTE]mystic said this in post #146 :


she picked the only kid she could with a dad and family and offered money to them.

Well if you are saying that is false then Madonna must be a liar because she said that is what she did.

Geesh, havent you read anything from the Lodgebo newspaper???
[/QUOTE

Wow now I am printing and distrbuting newspapers and I thought I was a plain old consultant. Funny how I am not the only that made these claims but you picked out me is it because I am always on your mind?


Old Post 11-02-2006 03:47 PM
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post #149  quote:

quote:
Lawless said this in post #140 :
If he doesn't WANT the kid back, then they need to just move on, and leave things alone. Sheesh, who knew that a person trying to do something good, by taking a child out of a poor living situation, and give them a much better life, would end up being like this.

Makes me so glad that I'm not famous... because I would be pissing the world off, left and right.


For starts, Madonna is no saint. Just because she likes the missionary position it doesn't make her a Missionary. For seconds, she bought a kid. Plain and simple, zip and pip, good night and good luck.

Thank you New York, I am outta here!

-HECK!


Old Post 11-02-2006 04:27 PM
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post #150  quote:

And what do you call others who pay money to adopt a child? I guess this world is just full of f'd up people.

Old Post 11-02-2006 08:24 PM
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