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bitwiz44
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Cool Cults -the worship of Lucifer post #1  quote:



In Laci peterson threads we discussed the Defense theory of a Satan cult kidnapped Her for a sacrifice to Lucifer. Many dont believe this type of cult exisit. But there is those who do and or have been in a cult. This is not to be confused with witch Craft because its not the same. This is a type of religion perhaps like worshiping God...but worshiping Lucifer, Satan. the Devil as he is called.

So Im reaching out for your Experience, knowledge or opinion about this type of cult on this thread. Thank for reading and sharing your posts.


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Jonalan
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post #2  quote:

I researched satanism in New Zealand for my MA thesis a couple fo years ago. Very small here and not at all what the stereotypes suggest it is like. I took part in a Voodoo ceremony which I found interesting. Is there anything specific you would like to know?
Jonalan


Old Post 07-03-2003 12:52 AM
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bitwiz44
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Cool post #3  quote:

quote:
Originally posted by Jonalan
I researched satanism in New Zealand for my MA thesis a couple fo years ago. Very small here and not at all what the stereotypes suggest it is like. I took part in a Voodoo ceremony which I found interesting. Is there anything specific you would like to know?
Jonalan


Yes...All You will share.

Start with whats different..Thanks


Old Post 07-03-2003 04:42 AM
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Jonalan
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post #4  quote:

Whats different? Well its is as diverse as Christainity , lots of different groups and ideas. Devil worship is the belief and worship of the devil as protrayed in xian writings. Satanism is the belief and acceptance of both dark and light magick, the left and right paths. Any magick practioner can be a satanist, once they use magick to influence another persons life they are using dark magick.
Some satanists use drugs in their rituals some don't. For exaple the Order of the Left Hand Path, later called Ordo Sinistra Vivendi, that used to be here in NZ would not permit anyone into their meetings if they were under the effects of any drugs. Alcohol is used as it is used in xianity, as a sacrament.
American satanism, LaVey style especially, is considered fake.
Most tend towards 'traditional satanism', european mythology (Norse, Germanic etc) for inspiration. For them satan does not exist but is an archtype.
Its a huge subject, each group is different as there is an emphasis on being an individal, not part of the herd (read Nietzsche).
There is heaps more I could go on about, what would you like to expand on?


Old Post 07-03-2003 09:25 AM
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bitwiz44
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Cool post #5  quote:

THanks for your post.

Human Scarifce,,,gifts for lucifer ETC.


Old Post 07-04-2003 02:39 AM
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Jonalan
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post #6  quote:

What is your interest in human scarifice?
It is more myth than reality.


Old Post 07-06-2003 08:02 AM
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bitwiz44
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Cool post #7  quote:

Not long ago, I got a hold of a book. As far as I can tell It appears to be a 'one of a kind'. The covers are wood and Skin or hide. All hand written. I was told it is a family heir- loom approx 200 years old . very difficult to read. while some of it was like scripture with difficult words to pronouce, it told of what lucifer would reward for certain gifts to him.

" A soul yet un-born of a womb free of sin" was one of the gifts.
(a loose translation but close to original text)

this gift was to be presented at a certain time of the year. Apparently by counting the "moons" one would know the is right. the 'calender" described is not like the common one we use.


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Jonalan
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post #8  quote:

Certainly it is written about in dark writings but it is not practiced to a great extent. Animal scarifice is common.
All religious beliefs require some type of offering to the god(s). How effective or powerful they are depends on the believer.
The Maoris in NZ believe that some sites are tapu (sacred) and descration will result in illness or death. But there is no evidence to support this, therefore it remains a religious 'myth'.
It sounds like devil worship as it refers to sin which is a xian dogma. According to some xian theology all humans are sinful (original sin inherited from Adam and Eve) so a sin free soul, born or unborn, could be difficult to find. Devil worship is the inverse of xianity and can not exist without it. Satanism, in its pagan form, pre dates xianity.

A young baby is covered over with flour, the object being to deceive the unwary. It is then served before the person to be admitted into the rites. The recruit is urged to inflict blows onto it - they appear to be harmless because of the covering of the flour. Thus the baby is killed with wounds that remain unseen and concealed. It is the blood of the infant ? I shudder to mention it ? it is this blood they lick with their thirsty lips; these are the limbs they distribute eagerly; this is the victim by which they seal their covenant. (Wilken, 1984:19)

As mentioned, covens pay homage to Satan, just as traditional religions honor God. ? Elements such as feces [sic], urine, vomit and animal blood were also employed. ? Animals, such as dogs and cats, were sacrificed to Satan and their blood drunk in fertility rites or for other purposes. Some covens, questing for the ultimate sacrifice, offered humans to the devil. Some contemporary witches, trying to distance themselves from their own traditions, discount the volumes written concerning the Black Mass and human sacrifice. ?. Some will even concede that militant, drug-ridden, hard-core Satanist covens active today have carried those practices into the 1980s. (Terry, 1988: 263)

For many people these two citations represent the reality of Satanism. The perception is of a cult whose practices include degenerate sex, human sacrifice and cannibalism. The use of ?cult? here is popular usage rather than as an academic term. However, the first quotation does not support the allegations of the second. The first is in fact the writings of the third century CE Roman author Minucius Felix, writing about a new cult that we know today as Christianity. While the allegations are similar, there is also another commonality between the two quotations. They are both based on anecdotal information. Rumour, urban legend and folklore all play a role in creating what is stereotypically known as Satanism.

You may find this site useful: http://www.religioustolerance.org/satanism.htm


God is dead.
Friedrich Nietzsche

Lucifer also has died with God, and from his ashes has arisen a spiteful demon who does not even understand the object of his venture.
Albert Camus


Old Post 07-07-2003 05:45 AM
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bitwiz44
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Cool post #9  quote:

quote:
Originally posted by Jonalan
All religious beliefs require some type of offering to the god(s). How effective or powerful they are depends on the believer.

I have to Agree.



It sounds like devil worship as it refers to sin which is a xian dogma. According to some xian theology all humans are sinful (original sin inherited from Adam and Eve) so a sin free soul, born or unborn, could be difficult to find. Devil worship is the inverse of xianity and can not exist without it. Satanism, in its pagan form, pre dates xianity.

I could be wrong...I thought it was the 'Un-born" hasnt inherented sin yet. Kinda a loop hole so to speak. Snagging the soul just before full 'birth" or natural birth....Like C-section

A young baby is covered over with flour, the object being to deceive the unwary. It is then served before the person to be admitted into the rites. The recruit is urged to inflict blows onto it - they appear to be harmless because of the covering of the flour. Thus the baby is killed with wounds that remain unseen and concealed. It is the blood of the infant ? I shudder to mention it ? it is this blood they lick with their thirsty lips; these are the limbs they distribute eagerly; this is the victim by which they seal their covenant. (Wilken, 1984:19)

Simular to " blood of christ and the body of christ" format during Mass.



just for conversation...Lets suppose The Bible is real as many 'Believe". It speaks of Gods power, The devil having equal but 'Dark" power. The bible states giving of 'tides'. Fasting, and some other sacrifices for man to do proving his worthyness to God. You are rewarded for 'Following" Gods way. many believe or state their good fortune came from doing Gods work.
There is many stories about satan having the greatest power of Decieving Man, Beware.
Ok...No 'accepted" proof of human Sacrfice. Hmmm. To believe In god, one also believes that Satan Exisits. Then Its possible that Satan protects his followers too. 'Changing' or 'Altering" evidence that would benefit 'his children". Satan gives them his 'power of Disguise".
BTW , good link...Thanks

it easy for those to say...There is no accepted proof of satan worship and sacrfice, on the flip side what is the accepted proof About god?

For my short Time of looking into this because of LP, when I see the 'Missing' persons posters, I have to wonder...Maybe, just maybe some are recruited or sacrificed.


Old Post 07-07-2003 04:32 PM
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Jonalan
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post #10  quote:

The Bible is difficult to understand on issues such as Satan etc as it has been interpreted in many various ways. Good vs evil is not a Jewish concept but a Persian idea. It found its way into Jewsih thought through the influence of Zoroastrianism during the exile period. Judaism is about choice, people choose to follow their good inclination or bad inclination.
Satan has no independent power from God. In the book of Job he appears as mans adversary not Gods antagonist. And can not act beyond the limits set by God.
Human sacrifice pre dates xianity, and Judaism too, and is found in many cultures. It probably does occur today but not to the extreme that has been in the media, especially during the late 80's and early 90's.
Good and evil exist but they do not prove the existence of God or satan. The existence of any god is a matter of personal belief. If some one does conduct a human sacrifice it is to appease their beliefs but not necessarily the demands of their god.
Perhaps calling it satanic and a human scarifice is just a way to understand an otherwise senseless killing?


Old Post 07-12-2003 12:17 AM
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