Kobe is not innocent, just PRESUMED innocent

Kobe Bryant Forum

point to argue to the detractors and those wearing blinders:

There is NO SUCH THING as "innocent until proven guilty !!! Those arguing such things have forgotten two things:

1. They must mean "PRESUMED innocent until proven guilty" which is DEFINITELY different. If you rob a bank, you are guilty, even tho the trial hasn't happened yet. YOU know you are guilty, the bank clerk certainly knows you are guilty, those witnesses who saw you rob the bank definitely know you are guilty, and the police and prosecutors who have seen the video also KNOW you are guilty. You are ABSOLUTELY guilty, but not proven guilty as yet in a court of law !!!!!!!!!

2. The accused is only "PRESUMED innocent until proven guilty" in a COURT OF LAW. Only in the court of law. This does not pertain to public opinion. Just to the courtroom. That means that the judge and jury should wait and withhold judgement until they see that the evidence proves your guilt. Until such time as the evidence shows your guilt, the judge and jury are obligated to keep an open mind and presume you are innocent. Nobody else has to.

Therefore the public and press etc. are free to see and say what they believe, and are under NO obligation to see the bank robber or Kobe as innocent. We are not the judge and jury. We can say he's guilty if we feel he is.

If he has raped this girl, Kobe Bryant is as guilty now , as much as he is at the end of his trial.

Just a thought, Sincerely,

Natasha, Toronto

What you're forgetting is that we ARE the jury. ANY of us (those above 18 anyway) could be called to jury duty tomorrow. The jury is going to be selected from the very pool of people that watch the news, hear the radio, read the newspaper, and who WILL be affected by what they see. We ARE the jury, and we have to maintain an open mind.

It disgusts me when the media and people in general pass judgement on an individual long before the trial has even started. I especially hate this excuse: "Oh, it's not MY job to keep an open mind..."

As an American, it IS your job to keep an open mind. Our justice system is an almost complete failure, and all you have to see to prove this is any high profile criminal case. People run around like chickens with their heads cut off when someone is publicly on trial.

I hope that people like you don't make it onto juries.

wicked

What is the name in our vocabulary for the male counterpart of "slut" for males? Is there one?

Anyway, I think Kobe is a (#$%$$@@). (fill in with whatever a male is called when he is a slut) That seems to be such a popular word today. ***** and or slut.????Kobe is both. Whatever they mean. I believe they have very, very broad meanings.

the tramp that Kobe raped is a slut. Doesn't let him off the hook, but she is still a slut, and everybody knows it. That is why they are protecting her name, because people know she is a slut.

That isn't true.Exactly how do you know she is a tramp or slut? And what is your definition of one? As a sexually assaulted victim my identity was protected to keep people from blaming me and calling me a slut. (and having his friends hiring a hit man) People just do not want to think a man would take it from a woman. It has nothing to do with his or her looks or money. It is about power and about insisting on having your way.

Even sluts have rights. Even you... if your sister or mother is a slut or a prostitute I would say that a man does not have the right to push her, if she says no. Even if your mother led him on and then changed her mind, I would say to my own daddy, "Hey man that's too bad, she said no and changed her mind, so put it back in your pants." If your mother does every man on Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday, she has the right to turn a particular man down on Friday if she wants to. A woman's rights are not forfeited just because she is a slut or prostitute. If that was the case then millions of girls and women today could just be forced into sex and the man can just say "Well, your honor she is a slut so it doesn't matter." Being a slut does not cause you to lose all your rights for life. You are just a slut, but with rights to pick who you want to "get it". I guess all the girs in videos of "Girls Gone Wild" are sluts so any so they are prime meat for raping by men with your obvious definition.

Illogical, biased and legally absurd.

You have no legal background in either Canada or the U.S.

In the U.S. refer to the 4th. 6th and 8th amendments. By law, a person IS innocent until proven guilty (exception: many white female's opinion of an African American man accused of raping a white woman).

The law in all U.S states (taken from the constitution which all laws must comply with) basically states that a person accused of a felony (rape) is innocent until guilt is proven beyond a reasonable doubt. If you can follow that logic, which based on your post I see you are challenged, then the burden of proof is placed on the prosecution (state). This means in essence that Mr. Bryant walks unless the state can prove without leaving any doubt in all 12 jurors minds that he is guilty. The key, then, is where the burben of proof lies.

The real key to this case is going to be how well the defense eliminates biased white females such as yourself during voir dire (jury selection). Some jurors may be dismissed for cause by the judge, and the attorneys may excuse others in "peremptory" challenges without stating any reason.

Now, you may have personal views which are completely biased such as you do but from a legal standpoint - Mr. Bryant is the accused.

I am not discussing whether Mr. Bryant is innocent in the court of law or not but how people throw out the word "slut" to a female who is raped. I am not discussing "Katelyn" either. Any female who cries rape is automatically a "slut", because of course there is no such thing as rape. All women must make this up. Mine was by a stranger at knife point and he entered my bedroom when I was asleep. He tried to smother me to death and cut my neck. And Yes I'm sure I would not be allowed to be on any jury about rape. The cops immediately wanted to know what I was wearing, if I had been drinking, and on and on. It was automatically assumed I was lying. Yes I am white and he was black. It shoud not matter what color the person is. And by the way statiscally most rapes are done same race on race. Mine was not in the norm. I am not a lawyer and certainly do not wish do be in that catagory ever.(you mentioned my knowing the law)