Get Over It: The U.S. is NOT the Real Enemy! |
| Posted by: Americaaah | | May 28 — The human rights group Amnesty International has come out with its annual report for 2003. And guess who’s the group’s number one villain? You guessed it, the United States of America.
See full story:
http://www.msnbc.com/news/919020.asp#BODY
THERE WAS A time when policy makers actually listened to what Amnesty International had to say. But the group’s ideological agenda is destroying that group’s once good name. Today, the London based group blasted the United States’ wars of liberation against the Taliban and Saddam Hussein, claiming, “There is a real risk Iraq will go the way of Afghanistan.” Amnesty then suggested human rights had worsened in Afghanistan.
You heard right. Amnesty International believes Afghanistan was better off under the Taliban, and that Iraq was better off under the Butcher of Baghdad. No mention is made of the torture techniques employed on the Afghan people by Osama bin Laden’s puppet regime. The same goes for Iraq, where apparently Saddam Hussein’s Stalinist regime was preferable to a liberated Iraq, one that is now enjoying freedoms of speech and religion for the first time in 40 years.
The double standard is breathtaking, and it extends to other conservative governments across the globe. Amnesty attacks Colombia’s government for defending its people against Marxist terror attacks. And Amnesty predictably condemns Israel for committing “war crimes” against the Palestinian people. Again, defense against terror is no defense at all.
Apparently, members of Amnesty International have been in a deep slumber since September 11, or are so driven by a left-leaning agenda that their world-view is badly blurred. In either case, the group has proven once again that its only interest is promoting a left-wing agenda, instead of what it was meant to do. That is, protecting human rights.
—by Joe Scarborough | | Reply To this Message
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| Posted by: mystic | |
| quote: |
Originally posted by Americaaah
[BIn either case, the group has proven once again that its only interest is promoting a left-wing agenda, instead of what it was meant to do. That is, protecting human rights. [/B] |
Well, I guess they changed their agenda...hmmm....what good are they now, if they dont believe that human rights are in the best interest of the humans whose rights get stomped on?
Oh...that evil USA....LOL...they are ridiculous to even suggest that.
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| Posted by: nowar | | that's what I like with you guys: whenever someone say USA made a bad thing it's crap ..... 
you are so in "love" with USA that you can't even think that they can do something bad - the gov of course - ....
..........
euh by the way in Afghanistan, it was more secure with the taliban than right now ........ less rights for the women, totally right, but there was no fighting - so killed people -, there was no looting, ....... now they are free ....... | | Reply To this Message
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| Posted by: nowar | | yes I do ..... and I know they did bad things, and I know they are doing bad things and I know they will do bad things ..... and I'm fighting that, which doesn't seems the case of some people here ...
what I'm saying is: don't be blind because you love your country ..... | | Reply To this Message
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| Posted by: Dreamzwalker | | I for one, know the history of my country.
some perhaps do not - but I love my country - it is my home.
I may not like everything that they do - but your answer to my question is basically the same here.
People are going to defend their country when others put it down - even if they do not agree 100 percent with their country.
Like defending ones home from a robbery | | Reply To this Message
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| Posted by: Curley Joe | |
| quote: |
Originally posted by nowar
yes I do [love my country]..... and I know they did bad things, and I know they are doing bad things and I know they will do bad things ..... and I'm fighting that, which doesn't seems the case of some people here ...
what I'm saying is: don't be blind because you love your country ..... |
You are quick to assume that we are 'blind,' nowar—so be it—YOUR mistake. Doesn't surprise anybody though.
We can criticize our country and we do so when it is called for. (This is not one of those times.) You can criticize our country too, but don't expect any applause from us. It's sort of like when a parent reprimands his/her child. He/she only can do so, but not the neighbor down the street. 
The biggest mistake other nations make is to underestimate the U.S. and to assume this and that. Happens all the time. And regrettably, there's always a price to pay. Many European nations have learned this recently—not to mention Hussein and sons.
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| Posted by: Ireland | |
| quote: |
Originally posted by Dreamzwalker
People are going to defend their country when others put it down - even if they do not agree 100 percent with their country.
Like defending ones home from a robbery |
This is a very significant point.
Now, I ask you, in the context of this war, whose house is being robbed? I have heard the arguement being put forward both on U.S News Stations and from Senior members of the U.S administration (as well as on this forum), that this war is also about protecting America, protecting its freedom...essentially defending America and its principles.
Yet this war takes place in Iraq. Defending your freedom and your nation sounds noble, yet if reality is to be known and acknowledged, surely it is the Iraqi army and its people that are defending their country, defending their freedom, protecting its people and their nations sovergnty "even if they don't agree 100% with their country".
Now you are preparing to overlook the actual political and social ambitions of Iraqs people and install an unwanted and unsupported government, that I might add, will probably be overthrown in due course. You say you are liberating, yet the people you "liberate" condemn you and your actions...refering to you as invaders and occupiers.
You are preparing to "rebuild" Iraq, from the ground up. Sounds noble, yet what are you rebuilding? Well, you're rebuilding infrastructure destroyed by your military that includes water and sewage treatment facilities that are essential to the health and sanitation of the Iraqi people. Who is "rebuilding"?, U.S construction firms like Betchel and oil companies like Haliburton (good old friends of Dick Cheney) are "rebuilding", and they are set to make billions of dollars (ref. Bari Atwan - Al Quds / Sky News). Who will pay for this? Why Iraq will pay...through sales of Iraqi oil that now lies in "coalition" control.
So here it is folks, Iraq will pay, through its oil, (that it has been prevented from selling now for 12 years or so), U.S firms to rebuild the damage caused by U.S warplanes and cruise misiles that have been attacking Iraq now on and off for 12-13 years. Of course Iraq never really attacked back because it was too weak to.
Then again while the U.S were spying on Iraq they found out that this wasn't really true, Iraq was actually a threat not just to America but to the entire world... but it was keeping this a secret...from the people that were bombing them and systematically starving them for 12-13 years in case they might find out and bomb them some more...and from the people that were looking for their big weapons....who were also watching and helping them destroy those big weapons...in fact 80% of those big weapons...which wasn't going to help their cause of threatening the world at all....but still... this was, of course, neccesary...because the U.S needs to defend its freedom, its glorious liberty and principles from those "evil-doers" who let us remember, were preparing to bombard the U.S and destroy everything in their path in a bloodthirsty unprovoked rage that would end up with Iraqis marching up and down the streets of America's fine citys chopping off the heads of babies and kittens, while they laughed and cheered.
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| Posted by: nowar | | @dreamz and Curley
I was only refering to what mystic said:
| quote: |
| they are ridiculous to even suggest that. |
even suggest that ......... that's what I call being blind ....... even suggest that ......... | | Reply To this Message
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| Posted by: rowdyrjp | |
| quote: |
Originally posted by mystic
Well, I guess they changed their agenda...hmmm....what good are they now, if they dont believe that human rights are in the best interest of the humans whose rights get stomped on?
Oh...that evil USA....LOL...they are ridiculous to even suggest that. |
NO mystic... please check out the info. Amnesty International condemns nations around the globe who violate human rights.
The reason the right wing media attacks them so much now is because one of the countries in question is the US.
This group is dedicated to human rights everywhere, who do you think we should trust?
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| Posted by: USA1 | | Ireland
Too bad you can't speak for the majority of Iraqis. Bagdad alone has 5 million people and when 200 demonstrate, you jump on the soap box. Your information about what is happening in Iraq is one sided and of the minority opinion in Iraq sensationalized by the media. | | Reply To this Message
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| Posted by: rowdyrjp | |
| quote: |
Originally posted by USA1
Ireland
Too bad you can't speak for the majority of Iraqis. Bagdad alone has 5 million people and when 200 demonstrate, you jump on the soap box. Your information about what is happening in Iraq is one sided and of the minority opinion in Iraq sensationalized by the media. |
The main thing I have seen sensationalized by the media is "the glory and courage of US soldiers fighting for freedom"
"The heroic efforts of private Lynch, taking bullets, knife wounds, and firing away at enemy soldiers until her capture"
"The torture of private Lynch held prisoner by Iraqi forces"
" The daring rescue of private Lynch by Special Forces taking fire from enemy soldiers while freeing her"
Does any of this in retrospect not show you where the media bias lies?
Darn near the whole world realizes how much misinformation and propaganda this nonsense was.
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| Posted by: Americaaah | |
| quote: |
Originally posted by rowdyrjp
The main thing I have seen sensationalized by the media is "the glory and courage of US soldiers fighting for freedom"
"The heroic efforts of private Lynch, taking bullets, knife wounds, and firing away at enemy soldiers until her capture"
"The torture of private Lynch held prisoner by Iraqi forces"
" The daring rescue of private Lynch by Special Forces taking fire from enemy soldiers while freeing her"
Does any of this in retrospect not show you where the media bias lies?
Darn near the whole world realizes how much misinformation and propaganda this nonsense was. |
Get real, rowdy. You have a brain to discern hype from truth—but you're not the only one...
___
'The Statue of Liberty is no longer saying 'Give me your poor, your tired, your huddled masses.' She's got a baseball bat and she's yelling, "You want a piece of me?"'
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| Posted by: USA1 | | rowdyrjp
If you believe everything you see on the news, you will be sorely ill-informed.
How's that for a one liner? I got a million of 'em. | | Reply To this Message
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| Posted by: rowdyrjp | |
| quote: |
Originally posted by USA1
rowdyrjp
If you believe everything you see on the news, you will be sorely ill-informed.
How's that for a one liner? I got a million of 'em. |
The thing is I was responding to YOUR claim of sensasionalized media and their anti-war bias.
Your information about what is happening in Iraq is one sided and of the minority opinion in Iraq sensationalized by the media .
My response was to point out , NOT that I believe the media or don't believe the media, BUT that the media slant on this has been decidedly pro-US if anything.
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| Posted by: Ireland | |
| quote: |
Originally posted by USA1
Ireland
Too bad you can't speak for the majority of Iraqis. Bagdad alone has 5 million people and when 200 demonstrate, you jump on the soap box. Your information about what is happening in Iraq is one sided and of the minority opinion in Iraq sensationalized by the media. |
Your first point is extremely important. You say that Baghdad has a population of 5 million, you also talk of 200 or so demonstrating. Let me point something out to you. When Saddam Husseins statue was pulled down there was approx. 2-300 people cheering and celebrating. This was widely broadcasted all over news stations world-wide as a signal that the U.S led war was indeed a war of liberation. Even on this forum, "pro-war" members rushed online to throw this back to the "anti-war" members. However, everyday (even today) there are and were protests against the U.S led invasion and occupation of Iraq, these do NOT make the CBS evening News. On a shia pilgimage in the south of Iraq, shortly after the statue was pulled down, approx. half a million people protested against the invasion, carrying banners that read " No to U.S hegemoney", "No to dealing with Israel", "Bush = Hitler", as well as a host of others referning to the U.S as invaders and occupiers (ref. Irish Times / Sky News / BBC Newsnight), these protests did NOT appear on the CBS evening news. In Baghdad Shia and Sunni Muslims (portrayed by the west as divided ethnic groups) protested together on several occasions with estimates of 10,000+ (ref. Bari Atwan : Al Quds, Sky News), these protests did NOT appear on CBS evening news. Put your 2-300 "liberated Iraqi's" into perspective, realise that 60%+ of Iraqis want the establishment of an Islamic State that is being denied from them by the very nation that occupies its land and oil reserves. Can you deny any of this?
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| Posted by: USA1 | | And the other 4.8 million do not demonstrate in any way. It's the same as in the U.S. 10,000 or 1 million does not make the majority. Most who do not demonstrate in support do not need to as the actions are all ready in place.
Keep scewing, you almost have yourself convinced.
Another one liner.... | | Reply To this Message
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| Posted by: Ireland | |
| quote: |
Originally posted by USA1
And the other 4.8 million do not demonstrate in any way. It's the same as in the U.S. 10,000 or 1 million does not make the majority. Most who do not demonstrate in support do not need to as the actions are all ready in place.
Keep scewing, you almost have yourself convinced.
Another one liner.... |
The very fact that the entire population of Iraq will not have the opportunity to vote in, any method of government that would prove that they are and were against the U.S invasion and presence in their country, should speak volumes to you, yet it does not. Instead the Iraqi people will be presented with openly pro-American political parties who I might add have spent very little time in Iraq if any at all. If the United States is so confident of the support of the people they deem to have liberated, why not then allow groups that hold ambitions for an Islamic State to be put forward in the elections. After all they do represent the political and social ambitions of 60+% of Iraqi people. If the U.S is so confident that the "liberated" will back these pro-american groups, then why not take the opportunity to prove themselves correct by allowing them to contest with those who do not back the United States? Also remember that open street protest is a relatively new phenomonen in Iraq, considering this, also remember the protests I have already cited as well as others outside Baghdad, in fact all over Iraq including the protests in Al-Fallujah where U.S soldiers opened fire on unarmed* civilians killing 16 (*Eyewitness report from Daily Mirror: British Press : I will upload this report shortly) who were merely protesting for U.S soldiers to leave a school they comandeered as a military base.
The problem is your media do not report any stories that could tarnish the glory of the United States Military or the "hero's" that serve in them, to do so...in the current environment would be "unpatriotic". In all actuality nothing could be further from the truth. Since September 11th 2001, many Americans are stepping behind their leaders, supporting them all the way, regardless of the issues, regardless of the consequences.
I've said this before elsewhere but i'll say it again, your Government and your Media have done a better job of scaring you the American people than Saddam Hussein and his Iraq ever did. Watch the news tonight, actually listen to the reports. You'll here over and over again about "the things you didn't know" about ________(fill in the blanks) " that could kill you". According to your media, you are always under threat from something or somebody, whether it be as a nation or as an individual. There is always something to be afraid of. Now your fears are being highlighted and segregated into various colours to represent danger to be used as and when your President deems fit. You're actually being told how afraid you should be. Look to the past for reference on this, look to the 40's, 50's and 60's. Again I would recommend you watch Michael Moore's "Bowling for Columbine" for reference to this.
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| Posted by: Wolf_eyes | |
| quote: |
Originally posted by Ireland
The very fact that the entire population of Iraq will not have the opportunity to vote in, any method of government that would prove that they are and were against the U.S invasion and presence in their country, should speak volumes to you, yet it does not. Instead the Iraqi people will be presented with openly pro-American political parties who I might add have spent very little time in Iraq if any at all. If the United States is so confident of the support of the people they deem to have liberated, why not then allow groups that hold ambitions for an Islamic State to be put forward in the elections. After all they do represent the political and social ambitions of 60+% of Iraqi people. If the U.S is so confident that the "liberated" will back these pro-american groups, then why not take the opportunity to prove themselves correct by allowing them to contest with those who do not back the United States? Also remember that open street protest is a relatively new phenomonen in Iraq, considering this, also remember the protests I have already cited as well as others outside Baghdad, in fact all over Iraq including the protests in Al-Fallujah where U.S soldiers opened fire on unarmed* civilians killing 16 (*Eyewitness report from Daily Mirror: British Press : I will upload this report shortly) who were merely protesting for U.S soldiers to leave a school they comandeered as a military base.
The problem is your media do not report any stories that could tarnish the glory of the United States Military or the "hero's" that serve in them, to do so...in the current environment would be "unpatriotic". In all actuality nothing could be further from the truth. Since September 11th 2001, many Americans are stepping behind their leaders, supporting them all the way, regardless of the issues, regardless of the consequences.
I've said this before elsewhere but i'll say it again, your Government and your Media have done a better job of scaring you the American people than Saddam Hussein and his Iraq ever did. Watch the news tonight, actually listen to the reports. You'll here over and over again about "the things you didn't know" about ________(fill in the blanks) " that could kill you". According to your media, you are always under threat from something or somebody, whether it be as a nation or as an individual. There is always something to be afraid of. Now your fears are being highlighted and segregated into various colours to represent danger to be used as and when your President deems fit. You're actually being told how afraid you should be. Look to the past for reference on this, look to the 40's, 50's and 60's. Again I would recommend you watch Michael Moore's "Bowling for Columbine" for reference to this. |
Brilliant. It deserves reprint. What is really frustrating is that the public largely has no idea that this is happening. I would feel pity, if not for the hate that seems to spout without end from the mouths of the ignorant. In the end, all I can do is inform people as best I know how. If my efforts are unsuccessful, I will have at least tried. Often, the work of years of propoganda is insurmountable. But every great once and a while, someone actually listens, actually researches, actually thinks about it...those times are worth it. I have seen it even on this forum. Keep it up, Ireland. Some of us are listening....
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Post-9/11 Era Forum: Get Over It: The U.S. is NOT the Real Enemy!
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