World Ignoring America's Invasion in Somalia

U.S. Foreign Policy Forum

"This is a crisis, the U.S. is using C-130 gun ships to fire on Somalis who are resisting U.S. HEGEMONY in Africa. THIS IS AS IMPORTANT AN ISSUE AS THE MIDDLE EAST. " Out Now Coalition

The Pentagon confirmed Jan. 12 that U.S. Forces began an " on-going operation of air strikes in Somalia Jan 8, and the attacks are continuing, according to Citizen Journal Nepal.

Hundreds of families fled their home to Jubba provinces, in southern Somalia and dozens of innocent nomadic herdsman and their livestock were killed by the American and Ethiopian air strikes, according to British aid agency Oxfam.

U.S. forces entered Somalia last December 24 when Ethiopia launched attack against the Somalia Islamic Courts Movement, that toppled unpopular lwarlord Mohamed Siad Barre in 1991.

" I think the policy is wrong. i think that to go in and bomb that country with no authority is wrong" Rep. Donald Payne, chair of the powerful Africa Subcommitee of the House International Relations Committee

Hundreds of Canadians demostrated against American invasion in Somalia Jan. 20 at the U.S. consulate in Toronto. ( anyone here of this?)

The new Somalia gov is now working with neo-consevative policy analysts in Washington,according to OneWorld.net.

Shortly after the christian transitional gov overthrew the Union of Islamic Courts, the Bush adm. quietly gave initial payment of $40mil for the new christian gov.

Malcom, you're supporting the Islamist insurgency in Somalia then? Good to know. Might want to let the Department of Homeland Security who's side you're on.

-HECK!

AU commander in Somalia pleads for more troops

MOGADISHU (AFP) - The commander of African Union forces in Somalia pleaded on Tuesday for reinforcements as the AU's security chief paid a flying visit to volatile Mogadishu.

Ugandan Major General Levy Karuhanga called for more troops after meeting with AU security chief Said Djinnit, who was in the coastal capital for a one-day visit under high security.

Karuhanga, who currently has some 1,500 Ugandan peacekeeping troops under his command spoke as gunmen set off a roadside bomb and attacked a United Nations convoy heading for Mogadishu.

Two UN staff escaped the explosion unhurt, but gunmen immediately opened fire and wounded three policemen who were protecting the convoy, a police official told AFP.

"After we saw smoke and dust and then followed machine gun fire, we immediately sped off to avoid being caught," Abdi Shidane, a driver on the same road, told AFP.

Karuhanga told journalists at his Mogadishu airport base that more troops were needed to help patrol Somalia, where deadly insurgent attacks have in recent weeks plagued the capital and the southern port town of Kismayo.

"We haven't been able to fully get the full troops for AMISOM (the AU force) to be deployed so we are pleading for the member states of the AU to provide more troops," Karuhanga said.

The AU aims to deploy some 8,000 soldiers with a six-month mandate to help Somali forces take control of the country. The first Ugandan troops began deploying on March 6.

Burundi has offered 1,700 troops but has said it lacks equipment for the mission. Nigeria has offered 850 troops but has not given details of their deployment schedule.

Malawi and Ghana are also expected to contribute but the AU is still far from reaching the proposed 8,000 figure.

Djinnit on Tuesday held talks in Mogadishu's presidential palace, Villa Somalia, with interim President Abdullahi Yusuf Ahmed and Prime Minister Ali Mohamed Gedi.

"We paid tribute to the Ugandans who have shown great commitment in deploying the first batch of the stabilisation force," he said at a press conference, declining to give details of further deployments.

"This visit is also to give moral support to our forces on the ground. We are confident that the people of Somalia will understand the AU mission is the friend of Somalia," Djinnit said.

Military hardware and the final deployment of Uganda's AU troops docked Monday at Mogadishu port, as nearby mortar attacks killed at least three and injured 12.

Insurgents have vowed to attack the peacekeepers and have already targeted the Ugandans since their arrival on March 6. Two peacekeepers have been injured and flown back to Kampala.

The Somali two-year-old interim government is hoping the peacekeepers will help stabilize Mogadishu ahead of a planned national reconciliation conference next month.

Dozens of people have died since January when joint Somali-Ethiopian forces ousted an Islamist movement from south and central Somalia, including the capital, but suspected Islamist insurgents and allied factions have responded with deadly guerrilla warfare.

The AU force aims to enable Ethiopian troops to leave and Somali forces to take over.

It is the first international peacekeeping venture since United States troops led an ill-fated, UN-backed peace operation in the early 1990s.

Factional bloodletting has wracked Somalia since the 1991 ouster of dictator Mohamed Siad Barre, creating a platform for a civil war that has defied more than 14 peace-making attempts.
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-HECK!

Islamist leader defends Mogadishu insurgency as troops burned

MOGADISHU (AFP) - Angry crowds burned the bodies of two dead soldiers in Mogadishu on Wednesday, where fighting claimed some 14 lives, while the Somali Islamist leader defended the capital's bloody insurgency.

Exchanges of heavy weapons fire across southern Mogadishu killed six uniformed soldiers and eight civilians, after insurgents attacked a former defence ministry headquarters housing Ethiopian troops backing the Somali government.

Residents burned the bodies of two soldiers and dragged another through the streets, in a grim echo of the treatment meted out to US troops in a failed UN-backed peace operation in Somalia in the early 1990s.

Hundreds of angry civilians celebrated in the Baruwa neighbourhood as they set the corpses of the two soldiers ablaze, shouting: "You and Ethiopians will die," "Down, Down with Somali troops," and "We will burn you alive."

Nearby, a woman carrying a machete shouted obscenities against Ethiopian and Somali troops while stepping on the body of another dead soldier being dragged by a rope tied to his foot, an AFP correspondent said. It was unclear if the soldiers were Somali or Ethiopian.

Meanwhile the leader of Somalia's Islamist movement, Sheikh Hassan Dahir Aweys, defended the insurgency.

His powerful Islamic Courts Union was ousted from much of south and central Somalia, including the capital Mogadishu, in January by joint Somali-Ethiopian forces, but his supporters have since vowed to wage guerrilla attacks.

"If all foreign troops leave Somalia, we will settle our differences and everybody knows that," Aweys told the BBC Somali service.

"The people who are fighting in Mogadishu are defending themselves and nobody will question that right," he said from an undisclosed location in Somalia.

Meanwhile, Ethiopia denied that its troops had been killed in the fighting.

"We are against any sort of speculation that Ethiopian troops were killed today in Mogadishu," Fisseha Shawel, the Ethiopian embassy's Charge d'Affaires in Mogadishu told AFP.

Civilians were caught in the stray gunfire and shelling after Ethiopian and Somali government troops responded to the morning attack, according to witnesses and an AFP correspondent.

Residents in various neighbourhoods of southern Mogadishu reported that 11 people had died, including three other soldiers.

"We have so far received more than 60 wounded people. We are in a very difficult situation," said Dahir Dheere, the head administrator of the capital's largest Medina hospital.

The United States, which backed Ethiopian forces during the war with the Islamists, condemned the violence.

"It is an horrendous act. We condemn that in the strongest terms," US ambassador to Kenya Michael E. Ranneberger said of the bodies being burned, in a press briefing in Nairobi.

The Somali ambassador to Kenya, Mohamed Ali Nur, said that Wednesday's fighting was sparked by a government crackdown on suspected Islamist insurgents.

A planned 8,000-strong African Union force is trying to help Somali government troops regain control, but a spokesman for the 1,500 Ugandan AU troops already deployed said that they had not been involved in Wednesday's violence.

Meanwhile, media watchdog Reporters Without Borders Wednesday called on the Somali interim government to respect press freedom after it reported that a Somali reporter from Radio Shabelle and his driver were arrested and beaten up.

It called for their release in a statement and condemned "the mistreatment of journalists who were just doing their job."

The AU mission is the first international peacekeeping venture since US troops led the ill-fated UN peace operation more than 10 years ago.

Factional bloodletting has wracked Somalia since the 1991 ouster of dictator Mohamed Siad Barre, creating a platform for a civil war that has defied more than 14 peace-making attempts.

Despite the violence, Nur said Somali's two-year-old government had on Tuesday officially completed a move from the south central town of Baidoa to Mogadishu.

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-HECK!

Well Malcolm's right there is a crisis in Somalia a crisis created by Islamic terror groups. This government was overthrown and popular opinion suggest that the Christian based government is more popular and fair.

Malcom have you coondured this scenario by anychance. The US governemnt finds out locations of Islamic terror cells in Somalia, they approach the Somalian government and explain the situation, the Somalinn government realising that these terror groups could pose athreat to thier leadership agree to the US carrying out strike action against the trerroists, the US does it and in the course of action some innocents get killed. Are you saying there is no chance that might have happend.

There is ione thing about your atory ( no source of course ) but it says that many people were killedin Jubba maybe it' s a big area but nomadic people? the whole point of being nomdaic is they stay away from the cities unless they are selling at a amrket and there is no way any government would allow an aiurstrike on market day.

Also nice to see how concerned you are this happend two months and you were so outraged then you had to say something now right.

Just as well the Europena media covers Africa then I guess. See whjile you and Sen Payne ar having a go at the Ethiopians tou forget why they are there to protect a government that is popular with the people but is threatend by an Islamic group thaty is backlward and wants to restriuvt the rights of Somalians. Also if you had bothered to even do some reserach you wopuld would that had the Islamic group leaders ( who BTW are mostly tied to Al Quedia) taken thier head out of thier own asses tyey would have realsie they were not wanted by the majority of Somalis.

Also despite what you want to belive the US is not carrying out operations in Africa against Somaians. There ere two attacks in January that is well known and and accepted but what people may not have told you malcolm is that these were the first raids since 1994 so 13 years have gone by since that last time US guns were fired in anger in Somalia and secondly the attack was ot on Somalins per se but on Al Quieda leadership who were being sheltred by Somali insurgents now granted the actions of the Ugandan army in sealing off the town was probably an ill advised move BUT because of people like your freidns Sen Payne they can't touch the insurgents or the AL Queida members unless they are attacked first.

Also have you heard os Abdullahi Yusuf? of course you have because Somali is your area of expertese this month. Well you will also know that he backed the Us raids.

Anyway it all in the link I posted.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/6243459.stm

PS I agree with Javier Solana the AU has proved itself unable to control anything in Afirca maybe it's time to deploy some better trained forces in Africa.

It's sp pathetic Malcolm. Someone posts arguements that taer your rantings apart and instead of trying to launch a decent counter arguemnt you post crap like that, I assume your reason to not give a decent arguement is because you can't mount one.

And what you have posted anyway proves your ignorance about simple facts. Firstly let me congratulate you for being the first person to accuse the BBC of parroting the Bush admin. Hell if anything the BBC is accused of being anti - Bush.
You can say the UK is lapdog country for Bush but what that has to do with Mr Yussuf backing the raids is beyond my comprehension. And finally BLair is resigning of his own free will he is not losing his job he is giving it up.
Face it malcolm you came up with this totally pathetic argument which BTW is kind of off topic ( something which you have moaned about before so practice what you preach) because you can't coem up with a decent arguement can you.

2 AMERICANS were among at least 10 foreigners caught by Kenya police at the Somalia border fighting with Somalia's ousted Islamic movement.

Well that should not shock anyone we sit all the time. How many foriegners have been caught fighting for the Taliban in Afghanistan, anytime you get some kind of Muslim uprising you get foriegners coming to help

Malcolm do you even know what insurgent means? it menas rebel so when we call the ex government and supporters of the ex government insurgents that is the correct term they are rebels trying to bring down the legitimate government of Somlia.

Also America is not invading Somalia the plane involved in the airstrike did not fly from a base in Somali because there is not one it flew from a warship carrying out anti terror operations in the region and once again the raid had the blessing of the Soamli and because of the location Kenyan governments. So how do you get the word invasion from that action? because I thought an invasion meant actually going into the country without approval the US has not done that.

Also I cannot understand how somebody who is meant to be all for a better Africa sees a bad side to this.
What Somalia had:
A repressive Islamic based governemnt with no rights for women and many groups facing persecution for relgious beliefs. A country on the verge of being removed from the AU, a country that had aid cut by the EU, a country that was in a civil war.

What Somali has now:
A forward looking albiet Christian based government
Womens rights are on the up
Relgious persecution al bit vanished
a country that is back in the AU and has seen a return of aid from the EU
A civil war that is all bit over and only Eithopian and Ugandan troops present to protect the government.

How is that bad for Somali or even for Africa. Somalia still has problems no denying it but things are getting better and if the insurgents stopped what they were doing the AU troops would like the NATO and US troops all bit leave and Somalia government could get on with making positive changes for it's people. How can you be aginst that.

PS I notice that you once are quick to have a go at America but no anger toward Eihiopia who have hundreds of tanks and planes and couple of thousand troops in Somali and no anger toward the 1000 Ugandan troops why is that?

Do you know what the Chinese are doing in Africa or is your lopsided opinion on the doings of the powerful just another onesided expression of one who has little power if any?

In case you had not noticed this is not about China or the African continent as a whole, this is once agina about Malcolm making a mountain out of a molehill and his unbelivable anger that an oppresiuve government has been removed from power in Somali. Also the fact that he cannot get stroy straight. One air strike in 13 years with the blessing of the Soamlian and Kenyan government from an aircarft carrier does not = invasion of Somalia that's a fact. Also Malcolms blinded view to blame anyone but Africans is a problem there ius anger at the Americans but not at the Eithiopians or Ugandan.

Now if you want to talk about China we can do that but be a bit more specific don't do a malcolm actually post links when you have the story and we can talk about it or you could read this whole thread get up to speed an realise that malcolmc story has more holes in it that Swiss cheese.

Sadly you are correct about the emotional and opinionated Malcolm. However when it comes to the Chinese my only concern is their obvious mastery of LONGEVITY and our countries apparent ignoring of certain ominous warnings that precede decline as evidenced throughout history.

I don't know where lapdog lodgebo gets his info on Africa but I'm sure FOX is a source. Someone who has never been to Africa writes as if he has.

According to Rep. Donald Payne the chair of the U.S. African Subcommittee :

When the people of Somalia- the Islamic Courts- decided that enough was enough, they went out and got law and order. Stopped the hijacking of boats. Stop piraracy. Opened the airport up. Opened up schools. People could walk around. Then the U.S. decided to back the warlords who been in control the last 10 years, when Somalia was lawless and ungovernable.

And also, they claim there is an al-Qaeda training camp that's benn there for 4 or 5years. Well, if it was there, it was supported by the people who were running Somalia who were the warlords. So, once again,WHY then when this new (Islamic Courts gov. takes over you decide all of a sudden to have a Somali-policy, and INVITE ANOTHER COUNTRY (ETHIOPIA) TO INVADE SOMALIA? ( good point)

Heres a good article on waht is happening in Mogadishu read it and you might work out what is going on over there:


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070331...Dtpf0YLs6ZvaA8F

Well maybe he does because if he is the source of your info like you he knows f**k all about what is going on in Africa.

According to report by the Center for Research on Globilization, OIL is the root of( US supported) invasion of Somalia.

Conoco Somalia Ltd. has been exploring for OIL in Somalia since 1952 along with other major oil companies Amoco, Chevron and Phillips].

During time of puppet Somalia regime of Mohamed Siad Barre, who was overthrown in 1991, all of OIL companies made there deals to exploit Somalia for OIL.

U.S. military has become miltia for OIL companies and greedy politicians. They are expendable and have become brainwashed because of consertive media.

So now it's oil .

You know I will never get you malcolm at first you appear to be a guy that is for a better Africa and thier is nothing wrong with that it's a noble cause indeed. Yet at the same time you are alying into those same people who are trying to help Somali progress.

Malcolm let me ask a few question just to se where you stand on the African continent:

Somali better or worse off now?
Sierria Leone - was the UN and UK right or wrong in what we did?
Mugabe is this guy a positive or negative force in Zimbabwe?
Darfur - if the AU cannot/ will not do thier job should Europeans come in to take control?
Are you for or against African nations helping other African nations in times of crisis?

See I am asking these questions not to get on your back just to see if you really are pro Africa just intrested to see what your answers are, oh and BTW before you claim off topic when you answer these questions you will see the relevence to this topic.

[QUOTE]malcolm xx said this in post #26 :
[B]

Is Somalia a county l that has been INVADED and being BOMBED daily better or worse? I don't know American conservative media doesn't cover news in Africa ,BUT I'm sure its not better.

Firstly let me say I i am going break up my reply in to 4 seperate posts.

Ok firstly Malcolm heres a link to some new news from Soamli as it is painfully obvious that you don't know what going on in Somalia. [URLhttp://www.signonsandiego.com/news/world/20070604-1637-somalia.html[/URL]

It's alos worth noting that after the attack Gedi asked for international assistance and UN top brass are going to Somali to discusss the situation.

Now this invasion theory let me try and break it down for you 1. There are no US troops or bases in Somalia anymore and 2 the AU forces were invited in to try and keep the peace ( see the link I posted mentions Eithiopians) so where is this invasion?
As for the bombings the daily bombings are coming from the insurgents nobody else is causing daily carnage but them and you seem to want to defend them why is that?

The fact is Soamlia was in a mess in the 90s and when Gedi took power evryone thought it was a new dawn and a bright future for poor Somali and these people you want to defend are ruining it for these people.

You back them and you are pro Africa?

[QUOTE]malcolm xx said this in post #26 :
[B]

I'm not aware of news in Sierra Leone BUT movie Blood Diamonds and books claim US/EU/ Israel are expoiting country's resources (Diamond Merchants).

Let me tell you what happend in Sierria Leone from somebody that was there. In may 2000 Sierrie Leone was in the midst of a bloody civl war and it was decided that and 880 strong British force and other European troops would go to SL to carry out operations some troops went to Freetown to evacuate Europeans and some ( including myself) were sent to fight the rebels in some of the hardest fighting I had been involved in. The final result was that by Jan 2002 45,000 rebels surrendred, the war was over and a demcratic governemnt was in place.
So was this a good or bad thing?
As for the diamonds get your facts right any diamonds that left SL during the war were smuggled and NOT tolerated by anyone it's kind of like drug dealers. ASince the end of the SL war though diamond mining is perfectly legal under licence. in fact the idustry is worth $130 million to SL.

[QUOTE]malcolm xx said this in post #26 :
[B]

Sudan has plenty of untapped oil and Darfur is being used to sanction country to create humanitarian crisis that EU/ US/allies will use as cover to bomb and invade country to control resources.

No Malcolm thats not the case and I find it amazing a pro African can sit there and condemm the world for trying to do something about 4.6 million people facing death and 200,000 already dead and rape of youg girls and women is rife.
The sanctions happend because the Arab Sudanese government failed to get the disaster under control ( not surprisng when they support it) and the UN wanted to send in peacekeepers to deal with the problems Sudan said any movement like that would be seen as an act of war and as such the US and EU countries have sanctioned Sudan. Let me ask you would you let the killing of innocent Africans go on or do you think we should sanction a government that is killing it own people?
As it stands right now Sudan cannot sell oil to the outside world and nobody except you has made this a war for oil arguement you can't even back that claim up.

[QUOTE]malcolm xx said this in post #26 :
[B]


I don't know if President Mugabe is good for Zimbabwe, BUT Tony Blair has he doesn't want leave without having to " overthrow Mr. Mugabe."

You don't know if he has been good for Zimbabwe. Well lets see the country is in economic freefall at least 1 million people have vanished, opposition party mebers are tortured as are lawyers, press is banned, regular power cuts, gays tortured, threats of war with Congo and villages detroyed if they show support for other parties.
Actually you are right Blair does want Mugabe gone well Blair, the US, EU, UN, AU and his own people. It is really only S.Africa that can stop him and they are losing patience mainly because the pressure on from interanmtioanal community and the number of refugees is reaching saturation point so S Africa would have no choice but to cut the power 24/7 and destroy Zimbabwe forcing a revolution of kind.

That US/UK agreed to fund Zimbabwe's current Whites to Blacks land transfer in 1979 through THE LANCASTER HOUSE AGREEMENT . Then Uk Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher gave Mugabe gov. initial 40 mil but did not fufill agreement with Ronald Reagon.

The agreement was not fulfiled because of Mugabes record you cannot give money to somebdiy with his record can ya.

Finally and sorry for breaking it up into sections.

To answer your final question malcom I am pro Scotland but that means admiitng whern my country has done something wrong.

The thing is your malcolm your post proved what I thought it would I knew that you would blame everyone else for Africa problem but Africans themselves get off lightly an this is a problem Africa has and they need to sort it out they can't ask for help from the intl community and then complain that we interfere.

I think the thread might be more aptly titled "American ignoring America's presence in Somalia".

Seems the press only cares about Iraq and Paris Hilton.

-HECK!

IF and it's a big IF there are Americans in Somalia it will either be special forces or secret service agents going after Al Quedia operatives and I for one have no problem with that.

There are no US bases in Somalia
The Ugandan and Eithiopian forces are keeping peace in Somalia they don't need the US
Al Quedia are on the rise in Somalia
The Somlia president has given his permssion for airstrikes against al Quedia agents so how that counts as an invasion has never been explained by malcolm
All Airstrikes have been carried out from warships not from land bases.
There have been 2 airstrikes in Somalia by US forces not the daily airstrikes as malcolom claims
In both airstrikes high level AL Qudia members were killed and by a stroke of luck a high ranking anti government member was also killed.

so first you complain about the US in Africa and now you want the world to leave Afdrica to the USA

Once again Malcolm your ignorance of the United Kingdom shines through it's almost as bad as your ignoramce about Africa.
Howevere let see if you can prove me wrong tell me what you think are Scotland problems? Oh and it was not a spill I think you meant the shut down it was barely even newsworthy in the UK.

Oh and FYI if Scotrland became independen it would not just be indpeendent of England but wales and Northern Ireland.

As for the Prime Minister I don't know if it's a problem as such and if it is it's a problem for the UK as a whole.
Also I thought somebody like yourself would be in support of Gordon Brown. We know you are ignorant about Africa but even you must know that Brown is commited to Africa increasing aid, improving education to a western standard, cutting out corruption, and getting drugs for all who have AIDs in these states, he is commited to working with everyone from the EU, UN, Vatican, US to help with his plan he has already congratulated Scotland for our work in Malawi and hopes to see more work like it in the future.
Of course if you want Gordon Brown ( who BTW is Scottish 2 Scottish PM's in a row) and Scotland could just abandon our plans and pledges and levae it all to the USA.

See malcolm you have got nothing. Your reply to my post is to use my post thats pathetic and truly shows your intellectual level

Shame I would like to see this link that details Scotland problems.