Words of thought about Iraq

Iraq Forum

We are indeed witnessing an historical moment in time. For the first time, Iraqis are getting to vote. This is a huge victory for them amongst all the chaos they’ve endured over there lifetimes. If this vote proves to be successful, this would be a great feather in Bush’s cap.

However in reading these threads I continue to marvel at those that are simply in denial about what actually is taking place before them. Denying what their eyes tell them in favor of misdirection, fables, and hidden agendas.

We all have heard about the great tyrannical ruler Saddam Hussein and his tons of WMD, striking fear in many never before seen in America. However since that claim was proven to be false we now have no other recourse than to shift our bases to some other foundation to support our hasty invasion of Iraq. We are subsequently told of how such an evil man has killed thousands of his own and in fact we used these bases to some degree when we fought the Persian Gulf War in 91.

We now unfortunately have to make the best of our debacle. We cannot simply slip out of Iraq leaving them to their own devices. We must make the best of our mistakes and no one would disagree that democracy is a good step. After all, a free Iraq makes this a better world doesn’t it?

Issues taken with Bush aren’t about the many reasons I’ve seen given in these forums. I’ve heard just as many reasons why people want to see Bush fail as I did Bush and those of his supporters give for why we invaded in the first place.

Anyone who believes we did this for the Iraqi people is simply misled. Indeed this is more about what Iraq has to offer than about its indigenous inhabitants. If you do not think so, I suggest those of you who do not (and does for that matter) go see the movie called “Hotel Rwanda”, that is if you can find it in a theatre near you. (I suggest you use the internet to find it). It is an historical accounting of what happened in Rwanda in 1994.
It is an historical account of how the UN (and US) chose to handle what was an horrendous genocide egregiously ignored by the leaders of the free world..

Those of you whom live in delusions of grandeur and benevolence will see what is still in the hearts of world leading nations that pick and chose whom we choose to “free” and whom we choose to leave in bondage.

If after seeing this movie you can still believe that the Bush has done this for the people of Iraq, then you are farther removed from reality than even I could ever realize.

Interesting and lucid thoughts. I for one wish the elections in Iraq to be a success, whatever if this happens to be positive or not domestically for Bush. If democracy prevails we all have something to win from that in the long run.
However the problem resides as to how the Bush admin can keep pretending to defend liberty worldwide when in fact dark forces and big $$$ are at play - exactly as it is in France and other countries of the western community. Citizens are being ripped off by cartels of politicians and businessmen but even though evidences are collected about the wrongdoings of these con men, some people keep biting the bait hook, line and sinker. I suppose that if Bush himself, tried in a court, went to admit his wrongdoings, you would have people still in denial here.

JY, what supports of Bush simply do not understand is that the end never justifies the means no matter how great (or awful) the end turns out to be.

There will always be those who simply want Bush to fail because he was wrong and yes, that’s exactly what he was about Iraq. However some people are simply unable to separate the two events and seek to now retroactively sanctify the invasion on the grounds of democracy.

We don’t just need a democratically free M.E. but rest of the world as well. However should a autocratically oppressed nation haven’t much to offer in the way of spoils, we will be less eager to free such a nation from their tyranny.

It was the right thing to go to war with Iraq and depose of their regime.

January 30, 2005 is the proof. People all over felt it was such a wonderful thing to have happened, the elections. Proud and happy for the Iraqis. The only ones who did not share this feeling are people such as Moureen Dowd and of course the Islamic radical fascists like Zarqawi and Bin Laden.

This war was going to happen within the next decade anyway.

The decrepit old fashioned tyrants of Syria and Iran, they should be wary of their future.

Democracy is the way to a more peaceful world.

George W. Bush is a good man.

I understand your point perfectly. It is the "No Blood For Oil" stance that you hold, still. Beyond that, we are just in disagreement.

It also depends on what sold us to support the war. Some supported the war solely on the notion of WMD being present. Others, like myself, favored the effort because we were not comfortable with Iraq Ba'ath party operated oil fields, the documented brutally of it's people, and the consistent breaking of UN resolution agreements. Majorly, I supported this war also because of the probable and now definite (much more so since start of war) harborment of al-Qaeda types.

By the way, I appreciate you mentioning "Hotel Rwanda", a movie that depicts the horrors occurring in Africa. This is true genocide in the present day. It is shameful that the world has still not been eager enough to realize a way to truly help these people.

I knew of what only the media reported on Rwanda prior to watching that movie. I thought then, what a horrible thing to let those people die in such a way. Especially since we, the US were speaking of Saddam’s atrocities and brutalities of his own people. Rwanda was nothing short of this by no means, yet we ignored their plight, pulled the protection out of their county and allowed the genocide to continue until nearly one million were killed.

This is one reason why I don’t buy into the “we did this because S.H. was killing his own people” ideology because we didn’t.

If you would allow yourself to be taken back for a moment, it wasn’t because Saddam was killing anyone that the US sponsored UN resolutions against him were initiated. It was when Saddam invaded its oil rich neighbor Kuwait.

Saddam by no means was the last brutal autocrat in the earth. There are many but what made him so appealing were the resources that he controlled. This is why the US sponsored these resolutions against him you mention. This is why we needed to get him out of there, and this is why we’re now helping the Iraqis receive their freedom while we lay in silence about other nations that deal with their inhabitants the same.

Saddam needed to go not doubt. However embellishing reasons to do so only to have them fall apart isn’t the right way of going about it. We need democracy in Iraq to what frankly comes down to exploiting their resources. Since democracy is also good for Iraqis we will use that to accomplish the agenda.

Why not Iraq? Is the question to be asked.

To me, it seems that Iraq, in addition to Afghanistan, was the only other country in the middle east that U.S. could get enough support from us (the public support) to take military action (war) in. The situations in Iran and sadly Saudi Arabia are a lot more unknown to the American public than that of Iraq (Saddam Hussein) and Afghanistan, where the Taliban (Bin Ladenism) was to be taken down.

Forgive me if you disagree with this, but I feel Iraq was the only way for the U.S. to position itself in the middle east to get a good handle on fighting Islamic radical fascism which threatens the U.S. at home and anyone that they deem an infidel. More dangerous than Nazism.

sordidmesh is correct.

although I think they could have picked just about any country and fed the public bullcrap and the giant flock of sheep would have supported it.

between Iraq, and Afghanistan we've got Iran surrounded.

Saudi Arabia is already pro-US: they do not need to be invaded.

Freeance Peeance.

Well at least he's acknowledging some of what this is about (Sordid) but not all of it Dekka00.

Iraq had absolutely little to do with Al Qaida and nothing to do with 9/11. We swallowed it (the public) because Bush presented it to us on a plate of fear. Remember it is the US that made the case against Saddam from the very onset and it wasn't because he was killing anyone or harboring any terrorist, which is still a load of bs.

Bush & company came into the White House with plans to go into Iraq and 9/11 was the catalyst for doing so. Feeding the public about ties to Al Qaida was a mind job and we bought it but who could blame us after the like so 9/11?

What Sordid and those positioned alike seem to forget, it was OBL not SH behind 9/11 and to this day the culprit is sill making videos while SH sits in prison. If you don’t think something is wrong with this picture, then you need to find a new cable company.

the US has been looking for a reason to march in and reform the Middle East for decades now.

9/11 was the spark.

the REAL reason Iraq was invaded was as a first step in a long campaign.

WMDs, al-Qaeda links, all those are are words used to gain support. I think even sordidmesh knows that. Heck, maybe everyone knows it and just won't admit it.