Gush-Shalom Picture of Arafat |
| Posted by: TWBR | | I never did, im just proving that Arafat might be interested in a 2-state solution. | | Reply To this Message
|
| Posted by: woolfe99 | |
What a surprise that the PA is a kleptocracy, that Arafat has been stealing money earmarked for the Palestinian people, and that money given to him by Israel to thwart terrorism has been used to support it.
I really think that Israel should give the Palestinians what they want: get out of the West Bank and Gaza, disband its settlements, and give the Palestinians a chance to govern themselves. Why should any of this mess be Israel's problem anymore?
- woolfe
| | Reply To this Message
|
| Posted by: Dreamzwalker | | - If i wanted people to believe i was a "good guy" i would try to wear little medals of support during a photo op too. Its so easy to fool a fool into believing that wearing such a thing means i support a specific cause.
Give them what they want? y? they won't stop until all of israel is theirs - and they have stated this time and time again.
until there is no jew in that section of the world, there will be no peace, but then again....if the jews were gone they would just find some other neighbor to start blowing up. complete circle.
wash rinse spin. repeat.
wash rinse spin. repeat.
wash rinse spin. repeat.
This is the way of those stuck 1000 years in the past living by the code of terrorism. | | Reply To this Message
|
| Posted by: Dreamzwalker | | rotf - he has always claimed that. the man is conniving liar. He tells the world what he wants them to hear or see and then his Terrorist group that HE HIMSELF created turns around and blows something up. He hasn't changed in years. I've watched him do the same thing for what - 15 years? | | Reply To this Message
|
| Posted by: TWBR | | Whatever man, im not going to even bother defending him, i hate him myself. | | Reply To this Message
|
| Posted by: oneofpeace | |
| quote: |
woolfe99 said this in post #6 :
What a surprise that the PA is a kleptocracy, that Arafat has been stealing money earmarked for the Palestinian people, and that money given to him by Israel to thwart terrorism has been used to support it.
I really think that Israel should give the Palestinians what they want: get out of the West Bank and Gaza, disband its settlements, and give the Palestinians a chance to govern themselves. Why should any of this mess be Israel's problem anymore?
- woolfe |
You honestly think this would satisfy them Woolfe? Remember this didn't all start in 1967. At that time they rejected Israels existence and everytime they lost something because of it they claimed it to be unjust.
The reason why they're complaining about "pre 1967 borders" is because that is their starting point. Before Israel occupied the West Bank and Gaza it was the same old thing with these people.
I simply don't believe it's that simple for Israel to give back Gaza and W.B and everything will be honky dorray. As it is now Hamas and the P.A. are jockying for position and power when Israel leaves. They will fight among themselves before accepting peace.
Some want peace, however I don't believe as long as Arafat is there, and as long as the P.A. does nothing about Muslim extremist, there will never be peace.
| | Reply To this Message
|
| Posted by: antizionist2004 | |
| quote: |
You honestly think this would satisfy them Woolfe? Remember this didn't all start in 1967. At that time they rejected Israels existence and everytime they lost something because of it they claimed it to be unjust.
The reason why they're complaining about "pre 1967 borders" is because that is their starting point. Before Israel occupied the West Bank and Gaza it was the same old thing with these people.
I simply don't believe it's that simple for Israel to give back Gaza and W.B and everything will be honky dorray. As it is now Hamas and the P.A. are jockying for position and power when Israel leaves. They will fight among themselves before accepting peace.
Some want peace, however I don't believe as long as Arafat is there, and as long as the P.A. does nothing about Muslim extremist, there will never be peace. |
I think that it would be okay if Israel gave back Gaza and WB. As for your last comment...basically what ever happens, there will be Muslims in the world killing Jews and Christians.
But we don't do anything to help the situation. Whilst the threat will always be there, we clearly aggravate the situation. By America and Britain invading two Muslim countries in the last few years, as well as the only Jewish country occupying another Arab/Muslim people, it simply makes them hate us more.
If we gave them what they wanted, it would stop a lot of mistrust and hatred on both sides. If it carries on like this, then nothing will be achieved, more lives will be lost e.t.c...
So oneofpeace, if Israel aren't to give it back, what do you recommend they do? They can either:
1) Give them what they want
2) Carry on occupying them
3) Chuck them all out into surrounding Arab countries
4) Kill them all
Option 1 is the only one that has any likelyhood of peace. A viable independant Palestinian state is what I support.
Option 2 just means more innocent lives will be lost, and it is quite pointless.
Option 3 is unreasonable, and will cause more hatred amongst the Arab nations and Israel.
Option 4 is something that even the most extreme Zionists have trouble supporting.
| | Reply To this Message
|
| Posted by: Dreamzwalker | | this all started the second day that israel was there after WWII - when iran, iraq, egypt and a number of other Arab countries attempted to destroy the jews since the British pulled out. they did this TWO days after the British and other troups left.
its been going on longer then that - but i'm going to start there for those who do not know their history. | | Reply To this Message
|
| Posted by: MichelAoun | | there is no solution TWBR as long as Arafat wants the refugees back so he doesn't recognize Israel | | Reply To this Message
|
| Posted by: woolfe99 | | One:
I'm not saying that Israel pulling out will solve the problem. I think its a terrible idea. But staying in is a more terrible idea. Right now, Israel has essentially no good alternatives. While I blame the Palestinians and surrounding Arab states for much of this predicament, I have to also acknowledge that Israel made a serious error in staying in those territories. It didn't matter that the Palestinians tolerated Jordanian and Egyptian occupation. The Israelis had been dealing with these people since the late 19th century. They had to know that the Palestinians would never tolerate an Israeli occupation, and that the plight of the Palestinians would become a propaganda symbol of the entire Arab/Israeli (or perhaps more accurately, Muslim/Jewish) dispute. No good could ever have come of it.
One way or the other, by hook or by crook, the Israelis will have to leave those territories. It would be wonderful to have a negotiated settlement and a peace treaty, but I don't see this happening in the foreseeable future.
The Palestinians will not be able to govern themselves on their own. Frankly, they would be far better off if Jordan annexed the West Bank and Egypt annexed the Gaza strip. But that should be the Palestinian's problem, not Israel's. They need to stop allowing the Palestinians' problems to be their problems.
I support strong border security for Israel, including a continuous fence around its border. Get the settlements out and that will remove the fences protecting those settlements that the Palestinians are complaining about. But they'll have to live with the border fence unless or until they become civilized. The fact is, the fence works.
Pulling out is a win-win situation for Israel. If the terrorism dies down, then they don't have to deal with that anymore. If it continues unabated, then the Palestinians have shown the world their true face.
- woolfe | | Reply To this Message
|
| Posted by: devildog | | In 2000, the Palestinians were offered most everything they wanted.
Many Palestinians said "We were not given Jerusalem.”
Well we know that they were offered east Jerusalem, including the Jewish Temple Mount. This would have given them ninety-five percent of the West Bank and all of Gaza. And Statehood.
What about Jerusalem, Woolfe? And what do you think the outcome would be if your idea was employed as you posted? | | Reply To this Message
|
| Posted by: woolfe99 | |
| quote: |
devildog said this in post #16 :
In 2000, the Palestinians were offered most everything they wanted.
Many Palestinians said "We were not given Jerusalem.”
Well we know that they were offered east Jerusalem, including the Jewish Temple Mount. This would have given them ninety-five percent of the West Bank and all of Gaza. And Statehood.
What about Jerusalem, Woolfe? And what do you think the outcome would be if your idea was employed as you posted? |
The same. I would leave West Jerusalem and the Jewish quarter of the old City with Israel and give East Jerusalem to the Palestinians, with an easement that guarentees Jewish access to the Western Wall. Ideally, the holy sites should be under UN jurisdiction, with free and open access to all. But that isn't going to happen because neither side will give up its current hold.
- woolfe
| | Reply To this Message
|
Israel & Palestine Forum: Gush-Shalom Picture of Arafat
|
