Hello

Israel & Palestine Forum

Hello people, i've been looking for a forum like this for a long time, i went to lots of forums and tried to heal the ignorance and lack of knowledge that people have in America, i am working on a Flash project on the situacion, and for all of you Israel supporters you will be surprised when you find out what you been supporting this whole time,

P.E.A.C.E

any one wanna talk to me , hit me up at AIM - RotarySlug

So after being kicked out of all the other forums for god knows what, you come here.

Awesome.

Who said kicked? I just gave up cause the people where mostly like you, ignorant and uneducated

TWBR you support terrorism? I just noticed your location. If so, why?

I dont support terrorism, i hate Al'Qaeda, Zionists, Nazis, and Suicide Bombing.
And i put Terrorist Country , USA . So USA = Terrorist Country

and when i say , USA = terrorist country , U.S supports Israel with bilions of Dollars and Military Weapons which are used to attack the palestinians. Thats only thing that i dont like about America, its a great place, but i dont like what the government does.

Why do the US gets the blame for Israeli success? Yes we do support them, but they had great success without our support. The war of 1966 was done completely without US aid. We all know the success of that campaign launched by the Arab nations.

Blaming the US is another excuse to pass the blame for past failures of their own. Nothing is ever their own fault, and to hear them tell it, they are innocent as angels and Israel is the great oppressors and the US is the reason for Israeli success.

What Palestine needs to do is clean up their act themselves and stop pointing the finger. Much of their problems are due to their own making.

Yeah yeah, Who supplies Israel with military weaponry? The U.S , who Supplies Israel with Nukes? The U.S , who supplies Israel with Billions each year? Israel , there are other countries who need those billions for a really good reason, and about the wars, im gonna go check them out.

TWBR sounds like a product of enlistment. Someone has told him many things probably pro-Palestinian, and he simply accepts it.

So this is why you blame the US for Israel's success? I would love to see where you got this information from TW, if you please.

Yes Israel receives support from the US. So do many other countries, but to blame the US for Israel's aggression on Palestine is simply another way to blame someone for their past failures.

Palestine didn't have to be in the condition they are today had they sought other means than this path. It's leaders squandered opportunities for that nation to better themselves and because of it, they decayed instead. Let's put much of this blame where it belongs. You think the world can sympathize with people who bomb resturants and buses?

The US isn't Palestines problem, so get that crap out of your head. That's just more garbage peddled by anti-Israel extremist to blame someone, anyone for their defeats of the efforts they put forth.

I hate to say it TWBR, but you're defintely wrong. I personally am a British Jew, proud to be British, although at the same time proud to have America as her closest ally. America is definitely not to blame, it is Israel who is to blame. True; America give Israel the money, however it is up to Israel what they then do with it.

What were they thinking?! Using money to defend its citizens?!

No, The U.S might not have to do a lot with this situacion but , The U.S supports it and we are too with our taxes, If the U.S never supported Israel, things might have been better.

If you consider a Nuclear World war III 'better', Sure.

You see? You people just go to the wrost solution , a WWIII, thats crap, all im asking for , is that Israel can let the Palestinians have their own state, thats all, get Arafat out of power and bring in someone that would make choices for the Palestinian people and not his himself like Arafat.

You said this:

True that about Arafat needing replaced, but ur forgeting one thing, the major reason that there are Terrorist Groups is because , Israel decided to do their own terror back in 1947 and now in 2004.

Very true TWBR - the first terrorist groups were JEWISH and ZIONIST, namely Irgun and The Stern Gang. Later, even Hagannah leagued with these groups.

And as for your Arafat comment, its quite true Arafat needs replacing, although its also very true that sharon needs replacing. Both of them are war criminals and terrorists.

No, not very true. TWBR where do you get that information that Israel committed terror in 1947 against the Palestinians? The groups antizion mentions above were resistant to British rulers not Palestinians.

Actually if you look into history you will find that the Stern Gang in particular turned their focus onto Palestinian civilians and massacred many Palestinian villages.

And this was during 1947 or after the 1948 war antizion? Remember again in the refugee camps, terrorist were based. Because they didn't come up with the name until later don't mean they didn't commit murders themselves.

Although I don't subscribe to Sharon's tactics, this is exactly why he went through thoes refugee camps in the early 50's.

You don't "subscribe" to Sharon's tactics? God help you if you did.

Trying to blame the problem on Sharon is a joke. The Israeli population specifically voted for a Right-wing hawk because they were sick and tired of the terrorism and wanted a "old military hero" to take care of things.

He was a hell of a fighter, but a shitty politician.

An "old military hero" - the same man who was found formally guilty by an Israeli commission of war crimes? That's a very bad joke.

http://www.nationmaster.com/encyclo...raeli-terrorism

have fun reading - and its a neutral site

$100 bucks that Merkava is going to say that its biased.

LOL. And it's only an encyclopedia. If he really wanted to see Israeli terrorism at its worst, I should give him an Arab link!

Sorry for joining the discussion so late, but i just registered to these forums today, so forgive me for "barging in"

Believe it or not antizionist, Ariel Sharon is indeed considered a brilliant tactician, and a gifted general. Alot of his military maneuvers are taught by most western military academies these days.

Also, all claims that Israel committed "terrorist acts" against the palestinian population before 1948 are completely ridiculous. Israel fought to to free itself of the British Occupators, and then declared itself an independent democratic state.
Also, any claims that Israel is committing "terrorist acts" against the palestinian population these days are just as ridiculous. Israel acts out of self defense against Islamic terror. The IDF (Israeli DEFENSE Forces), have a strict policy on engaging enemies and handling matters in urban warfare areas. IDF Soldiers do not shoot whoever they want whenever they want. They act in order to search and bring to justice TERRORISTS, not innocent civilians.

Back to the point, while i do not agree with most of Sharon's policy, and i personally would vote for someone else to be Israel's prime minister, Blaming the whole Israeli-Palestinian conflict on Sharon is wrong. The conflict started long before the Israeli state was established.

"http://www.nationmaster.com/encyclo...raeli-terrorism
have fun reading - and its a neutral site"

Neutral site my a**... Howcome this so called "encyclopedia" didn't mention all the terrorist acts committed by Arab organizations like the Hamas and IslamicJihad against Israel?
Not to mention, IN THE ARTICLE ITSELF, right under it's title is written: "*The neutrality of this article is disputed."

Next time, bring objective proof to back up your allegations against Israel.

If you look at the bottom of the article you dumb **** it gives you the option on reading about Palestinian suicide bombing on Israel and terror commited AGAINST Israel, if you actually BOTHERED reading !!

And by the way I dont blame the whole conflict on Sharon solely, however I blame him on what is going on now. The whole conflict is the fault of people who lived when Sharon wasn't even born.

Encyclopedia: Israeli terrorism

*The neutrality of this article is disputed.

hahahahahahha

http://www.nationmaster.com/encyclo...-against-Israel

Quote from your very own source:

antizion I think you need some anger managment courses

Fact are these gentlemen. Israel isn't going any where and neither is Palestine, so what do you do from here? Do you continue to blame each other, or do you move toward a solution?

As long as suicide bombers keep up their actions, there is no chance of it working. As you see now Israel isn't killing anyone, so when the next bomb goes off, unfortunately some innocent Palestinians will have to pay for it later.

I believe that most Palestinians and Israelis want peace. I also think that the ones who doesn't are in the minority. Both are tired of this, but I don't think the PA is in control. Palestine will errupt into civil war if the PA crack down on terrorism there. And since they won't do it, the peace process will not have any chance at all.

This is where I believe the majority of the problem lies today gentlemen. Just my opinion.

antizion I think you need some anger managment courses

And I think you need some Israel/Palestine tutorial courses


Israel isn't going any where and neither is Palestine

What Palestine? That was taken by the zionists over 50 years ago! Actually, why am I even bothering to debate against somebody who thinks there is still a country called Palestine? I recommend you do some research on the conflict and come back in a year once you have done some intellectual growing up.

Palestine will errupt into civil war if the PA crack down on terrorism there. And since they won't do it, the peace process will not have any chance at all.

How can they crack down on terror? Do you think that it is possible lets say for America to crack down on murder cases? And make it so that there would never be another murder in the whole of America??

Do me a favour. No man or government has that sort of control over his people. Even if the Palestinians cracked down on terror, there would always be that one independant nutcase who would jepardise peace. The problem is that Israel would then start the whole war again by retaliating to this attack.

Once Israel show a bit more restraint, and the suicide bombings become less frequent, Sharon and Arafat grow up and start acting like proper leaders should, maybe there will be a deal.

This is where I believe the majority of the problem lies today gentlemen. Just my opinion.

Your opinion - something I'm starting to value less and less. Once respected poster and debater, your now just a low-life who pretends he is neutral about the conflict then does his utmost to defend Israel.

Being a (proud) citizen of Israel, I can confirm that most Israelis are sick and tired of this conflict, and want peace. I don't know about the Palestinians, but i am confident the majority of their population also wants peace.

The problem is not only in the current situation, but in the future: Palestinians teach their children to hate Israel from the day they are born. This sort of brainwash will cause alot of trouble in the future, and severly damages the chances for a normal life for both peoples.

Perhaps they cannot eliminate all terrorist acts. That is 100% true, you can't prevent all terrorist acts, just like you can't prevent 100% of crimes. But you can make a serious EFFORT to do so, something the Palestinian Authorities again and again fail to do.

And how do you suggest the Palestinian authorities stop EVERY single terrorist? You think civil war is the best way to do it??

No practicalities there.

Palestinians never had a state and at the rate they conduct themselves, they never will.

Okay, so they never actually "owned" the land, but at least they had somewhere to live. Nowadays, they've just got a strip of land where they live in tents and get massacred if the small minority of their people does something wrong.

First of all, cracking down on murder cases is not the same as cracking down on organized groups that commit murders. You think cracking down on Hamas is the same as cracking down on indiscriminate killings? No way.

Okay, but the same principle applies. Why do you think that organised crime has not disappeared from America and Britain altogether? It is impossible to eliminate all of it. Israel's demands are way over the top.

I mean their demands that ALL terror should be stopped, as I demonstrated earlier this is an almost IMPOSSIBLE demand and the Palestinian authority have no where near enough power to impose such a demand on the Palestinian people.