Is Bush some kind of gangster? - Post-9/11 Era

Is Bush some kind of gangster?

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Posted by: h@ts

When asked if the Iraq contract restrictions violate international trade law Bush couldn't keep the grin off his face as he said -

"International law? I better call my lawyer."

Well if anybody was wondering about this guy...

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Posted by: jvstr

I read a good article about that....

Bush, Rice Refuse to Suffer Fools Gladly
December 12, 2003


I want you to hear the president from his cabinet meeting in the audio link below. The libs are going nuts over this rebuilding of Iraq, because they've been boxed into a corner. The liberals and the presidential candidates on the Democratic side are having to speak up for France and Germany! They defended France and Germany when it was time to go to war, they said we should have sided with them, we should listen to them. Now when France, Germany, and Russia are being aced out of this bid process, the Democrats are forced to defend France and Germany.

John Kerry even went so far as to say Bush's idea is F-ing stupid, but in this cabinet meeting, the president would have none of this and gave the following passionate explanation, "Make sure everybody understands that men and women from our country who proudly wear a uniform risked their life to free Iraq. Men and women from other countries in a broad coalition risked their lives to free Iraq. And the expenditure of U.S. dollars will reflect the fact that U.S. troops and other troops risked their life. Now, we want to work with all countries. We have a common goal, and that is to see that Iraq is free and peaceful. It is in every nation's interests that Iraq be free and peaceful. And we welcome contributions. We welcome people's willingness to participate in this difficult yet important job of rebuilding Iraq."

You just have to see Condi Rice sitting in the background during this thing. She just looked at these reporters, her eyes darting all around, like a Secret Service agent. She was frowning at these people. You could just tell she was thinking, "Who are these idiots, and why do we have to let them in here? We're discussing the fate of the world and we've got these blue-jean-clad, teeny-boppers in here giving my president a bunch of grief over things they don't even understand. Why do we have to do this?" I love the way the president answers all these idiotic questions

A reporter asks him about international law and Bush says, "International law? I better call my lawyer. He didn't bring that up to me." Folks, I love people that do not suffer fools gladly. This is the Bush cowboy swagger that the Europeans don't like. This is the Bush that I love. This is the Bush that I just get the biggest kick out of. "International law? I'd better call my lawyer." I wish I could have seen Condi's face on that one.

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Posted by: Curley Joe

quote:
jvstr said this in post #2 :
I read a good article about that....

Bush, Rice Refuse to Suffer Fools Gladly
December 12, 2003


I want you to hear the president from his cabinet meeting in the audio link below. The libs are going nuts over this rebuilding of Iraq, because they've been boxed into a corner. The liberals and the presidential candidates on the Democratic side are having to speak up for France and Germany! They defended France and Germany when it was time to go to war, they said we should have sided with them, we should listen to them. Now when France, Germany, and Russia are being aced out of this bid process, the Democrats are forced to defend France and Germany.

John Kerry even went so far as to say Bush's idea is F-ing stupid, but in this cabinet meeting, the president would have none of this and gave the following passionate explanation, "Make sure everybody understands that men and women from our country who proudly wear a uniform risked their life to free Iraq. Men and women from other countries in a broad coalition risked their lives to free Iraq. And the expenditure of U.S. dollars will reflect the fact that U.S. troops and other troops risked their life. Now, we want to work with all countries. We have a common goal, and that is to see that Iraq is free and peaceful. It is in every nation's interests that Iraq be free and peaceful. And we welcome contributions. We welcome people's willingness to participate in this difficult yet important job of rebuilding Iraq."

You just have to see Condi Rice sitting in the background during this thing. She just looked at these reporters, her eyes darting all around, like a Secret Service agent. She was frowning at these people. You could just tell she was thinking, "Who are these idiots, and why do we have to let them in here? We're discussing the fate of the world and we've got these blue-jean-clad, teeny-boppers in here giving my president a bunch of grief over things they don't even understand. Why do we have to do this?" I love the way the president answers all these idiotic questions

A reporter asks him about international law and Bush says, "International law? I better call my lawyer. He didn't bring that up to me." Folks, I love people that do not suffer fools gladly. This is the Bush cowboy swagger that the Europeans don't like. This is the Bush that I love. This is the Bush that I just get the biggest kick out of. "International law? I'd better call my lawyer." I wish I could have seen Condi's face on that one.


This is why the Dems will lose (and why America will win—is winning).
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Posted by: Dekka00

funny how the "international police" have no regard for the law.
funny how the "leader of the Free World" disregarded UN and international democracy, making them nothing more than dictators.
oh well...
maybe we did the right thing.

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Posted by: oneofpeace

The US uses the UN like every other resource to suit their agendas period. I think it's hypocritical to go to the UN for approval and only use what they approve of to justify and disregard the rest. The internation law thing is just more arrogant smuggness from our country among other things.

We have people here that think this is ok to point to UN resolutions like 1441 then turn around a disregard their request to give inspectors in that country what they needed. So we point to everything including Saddam's gassing of the Kurds 15 yrs ago to justify why we haven't found what we say is there in abundance like oranges in Florida.

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Posted by: Dekka00

I say no European/North American countries should be able to bid in the reconstruction of Iraq. It's a conflict of interest.

of course what I say doesn't matter.

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Posted by: mystic

quote:
Dekka00 said this in post #6 :
I say no European/North American countries should be able to bid in the reconstruction of Iraq. It's a conflict of interest.

of course what I say doesn't matter.



I think that a European/US country should do it, and hire Iraqi people to do the job. Why should another country get ANYTHING from something they REFUSED to participate in?

I dont see it as a conflict of interest....I think it would be highly unethical for another country who sat back and did NOTHING to all of a sudden find interest in rebuilding.....that would be nothing short of a slap in the face to the countries that fought for the freedom of the Iraqi people.

I was all for this war, and seeing the Iraqi people shouting and applauding the capture of Saddam....well, that made it all worth it to me. Because of US/Europe the Iraqi people are finally free.

On another note......(to all, in general)......why keep arguing over something that is not gonna change. Its done and there is no point in arguing it anymore......Was it not worth it for the freedom of other people? I think so.
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Posted by: h@ts

quote:
mystic said this in post #7 :
On another note......(to all, in general)......why keep arguing over something that is not gonna change. Its done and there is no point in arguing it anymore......Was it not worth it for the freedom of other people? I think so.


My point wasn't the contracts, it was Bush's comtempt for international law when asked about those contracts.

Bush is saying to the world he couldn't care less about internatinal law and is amazed anyone has the effrontery to even ask such a triffling irrelevance to one such as him.
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Posted by: Dekka00

h@ts: I understand your point. I was making a different point.

mystic: My point is that Iraq, not the US, not Britain, certainly not France or Germany, should rebuild Iraq if Iraq's best interests are going to be in mind. They'll need aid, of course. But it should be that: aid. Not an investment opportunity. One country should not profit off another countries hardships. Yeah, if we do that we will probably lose money. God forbid we actually help somebody for the sake of helping somebody.

Of course this is assuming morality has anything to do with politics.
Like I said, what I say doesn't matter.

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Posted by: oneofpeace

Dekka I think it naive on our part to believe that this war isn't inspired in part by profit among other things. Thus the reason for Bush prohibiting these other countries

When speaking of politics, one is often hardpressed to find morals in the same room. This war is certainly no exception by any means.

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Posted by: HECK!

quote:
mystic said this in post #7 :



I think that a European/US country should do it, and hire Iraqi people to do the job. Why should another country get ANYTHING from something they REFUSED to participate in?


Exactly. Only those countries who supported the operation should be able to receive the contracts. France and Germany didn't send troops over. They should just sit back and shut up.

-HECK!
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Posted by: mystic

quote:
Dekka00 said this in post #9 :
mystic: My point is that Iraq, not the US, not Britain, certainly not France or Germany, should rebuild Iraq if Iraq's best interests are going to be in mind. They'll need aid, of course. But it should be that: aid. Not an investment opportunity. One country should not profit off another countries hardships. Yeah, if we do that we will probably lose money. God forbid we actually help somebody for the sake of helping somebody.


Do you think we went there in order to make money off of a rebuild? C'mon! Of course the Iraqi people should do this...but I highly doubt they have the money to do this by themselves...and again, any country that sat around and highly disputed this war should not be able to go in and make bids. I do not think the Iraqi people have the money to fund a rebuild. They might have contractors, but what good is having that if you have no money.....this is where Europe and the US come in.....and no one else!




quote:
HECK said this in post #11 :


France and Germany didn't send troops over. They should just sit back and shut up.

-HECK!



Right on!!
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Posted by: Curley Joe

quote:
HECK said this in post #11 :


Only those countries who supported the operation should be able to receive the contracts. France and Germany didn't send troops over. They should just sit back and shut up.

-HECK!


Dang right, HECK!
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Posted by: JY_French

Just to be clear about it: if the Americans brings money to subcontractors ... they have the right to give it to whom they want. I believe that the problem is not here.
The problem is when you have the president of the US, who plays it swaggerly about it for internal politics profit, while on the other hand he sends James Baker in Europe to get from the banned countries their renunciation to former Iraq's debts. Coherence, humility, diplomacy.
The problem is when you have the US with a selective appreciation of UN resolutions - useful and relevant to legitimate the move for one of them, simply irrelevant in other cases. International law enforcement.
The problem is finally with right wingers praising Bush for all what he does and says, thus categorizing, blaming, willing to deprive from their American nationality all of their fellow citizens who dare disagree. Respect of difference of views.

My belief is that democracy is not divisible. Either you play it with the rules, or you live with something different. That's up to you.

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Posted by: Charles

quote:
JY_French said this in post #14 :
Just to be clear about it: if the Americans brings money to subcontractors ... they have the right to give it to whom they want. I believe that the problem is not here.
The problem is when you have the president of the US, who plays it swaggerly about it for internal politics profit, while on the other hand he sends James Baker in Europe to get from the banned countries their renunciation to former Iraq's debts. Coherence, humility, diplomacy.
The problem is when you have the US with a selective appreciation of UN resolutions - useful and relevant to legitimate the move for one of them, simply irrelevant in other cases. International law enforcement.
The problem is finally with right wingers praising Bush for all what he does and says, thus categorizing, blaming, willing to deprive from their American nationality all of their fellow citizens who dare disagree. Respect of difference of views.

My belief is that democracy is not divisible. Either you play it with the rules, or you live with something different. That's up to you.


Hi Frenchy,

Do you think Chirac will come out with some ideas on how to participate in iraq? I know troops wouldn't be reasonable politically, but do you think its time for France to announce something big? not to do with US - but for Iraqi's???

There is an opening now - a new page has turned - what if all the anti-bush leaders just forgot about bush for a while and thought about iraq?

I think it would be well received everywhere and win some points for France. wouldn't George look funny if he tried to oppose it?
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Posted by: JY_French

quote:
Charles said this in post #15 :


Hi Frenchy,

Do you think Chirac will come out with some ideas on how to participate in iraq? I know troops wouldn't be reasonable politically, but do you think its time for France to announce something big? not to do with US - but for Iraqi's???

There is an opening now - a new page has turned - what if all the anti-bush leaders just forgot about bush for a while and thought about iraq?

I think it would be well received everywhere and win some points for France. wouldn't George look funny if he tried to oppose it?


Hi Charles,

Good points and questions. I believe that in France there is a growing concern for more implication in Iraq. I don't share the secrets of the powers that be here, but I feel some will to step in. The problem is how to do it while keeping in line with the UN legality as defended from the beginning. Perhaps a shrewd move is possible. For the moment, there is for example the concern with Bush barring disagreeing countries from Iraqi bids, that has created a stepping back which has more to do with the principle and the form than with the content - ie the money. On the other hand, you have this sincere and spontaneous rejoicing here for Saddam's capture and acknoledgement of US militaries' efficiency.
Personally, I would appreciate something to be done now.
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Posted by: Charles

quote:
The problem is how to do it while keeping in line with the UN legality as defended from the beginning.


I think the UN is way beyond that. For months they have been urging member states to step in and offer support.

quote:
For the moment, there is for example the concern with Bush barring disagreeing countries from Iraqi bids, that has created a stepping back which has more to do with the principle and the form than with the content - ie the money.


First - That related to US sponsored contracts I think - not the reconstruction fund pledged internationally. The US should have the right to spend its money how it sees fit - or unfit.

Second - French firms are already subcontracting Iraqi contracts.

quote:
Personally, I would appreciate something to be done now.


Thanks.

I just think a lot of the governments that don't like Bush hate the timing. They want him gone - as do many americans. They would hate to do anything that could be interpreted (or in fact) assist him to get re-elected. Failing in Iraq would reduce his chances. Helping him stabilize Iraq obviously boosts his chances.

Whatever the reason for lack of support at any stage, as I have said from beginning, is deliberate. Now its time for French and Germans to "suck it up" and do the right thing - however distasteful they find it.
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Posted by: JY_French

quote:
Charles said this in post #17 :
I just think a lot of the governments that don't like Bush hate the timing. They want him gone - as do many americans. They would hate to do anything that could be interpreted (or in fact) assist him to get re-elected. Failing in Iraq would reduce his chances. Helping him stabilize Iraq obviously boosts his chances.

Whatever the reason for lack of support at any stage, as I have said from beginning, is deliberate. Now its time for French and Germans to "suck it up" and do the right thing - however distasteful they find it.


Yes, bad relationships with the Bush administration obviously puts a break to these initiatives.
Some people on this board express hateful views about "Old Europe", thus indicating that the "disapproval" - to say the least - of a part of the american public opinion concerning anti-war european crowd' stance is still alive. Conversely, as a kind of mirror attitude, an equivalent part of people here still have in mind, for example, hateful editorials in mad Murdock's galaxy of newspapers, with white crosses in an American war cemetery in Normandy, accompanied by outrageous comments .... these same people don't necessarily blame the Americans but surely the Bush administration.
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Posted by: Charles

quote:
Yes, bad relationships with the Bush administration obviously puts a break to these initiatives.


But I think it doesn't speak well of your leaders if they let personal differences get in the way of "leading" and doing the right thing. its quite petty in fact.

quote:
indicating that the "disapproval" - to say the least - of a part of the american public opinion concerning anti-war european crowd' stance is still alive.


I don't hate but I absolutely disapprove.

quote:
Conversely, as a kind of mirror attitude, an equivalent part of people here still have in mind, for example, hateful editorials in mad Murdock's galaxy of newspapers, with white crosses in an American war cemetery in Normandy, accompanied by outrageous comments .... these same people don't necessarily blame the Americans but surely the Bush administration.


I believe it! Do please post the links. I'd love to see how the anti-american/Bush people in Europe manifest their dislikes.
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Posted by: JY_French

quote:
Charles said this in post #19 :
I believe it! Do please post the links. I'd love to see how the anti-american/Bush people in Europe manifest their dislikes.


Charles, being opposed to the Bush administration's policy in Iraq doesn't mean being "anti-Bush", even less "anti-American". I want to insist on that point, and on the fact that common sense still prevails among sensible people - that is to say the majority.
I don't read anti-Bush litterature specifically, in general I am not confident in deeply politically-oriented stuff, whatever might be the slant of it.

Just to provide you with a link, here is one - please let me know if you need some translation. This is a "neutral" article from a French mainstream newspaper about the recent situation:

http://www.lemonde.fr/web/article/0...6-345676,0.html
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Posted by: Charles

quote:
here is one - please let me know if you need some translation.


Thanks - but I was hoping for images/cartoons.

As they say - A picture is worth a thousand words...
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