Do Arabs have double standards when dealing with non-Arab nations?

Israel & Palestine Forum

In looking at the Israeli Palestinian conflict, it seems that Arab nations are all in support of Palestine. I personally believe that the Palestinians have a legitimate gripe, however I take note to the fact that the Arab nations holds Israel to a hire accountability than that of their own selves.

I think it safe to say that the dominate religion among Arabs is Islam. Muslims say that it's their duty to come to the aid of Muslims everywhere that are in need. That is certainly understandable, but 2 questions stand out to me when I do research about the Arab/Muslim world.

First, what if your Muslim brothers are wrong in their actions? And secondly, what if your Muslim brothers are being wronged by other Muslims?

Clearly when Muslims perceive other Muslims wronged by non Arab or Muslim nations, they collectively come together around the world and cry out loudly in protest, often not without violence. But what happens when their own brothers are reaping the actions of their own transgressions? They still will protest just a loud, but what's even more deafening is the silence from the Arab/Muslim world when Muslims commit crimes against other Muslims.

One cannot ignore the vast terrorist groups the bare Islam or Allah (God) in their names while committing atrocious acts of violence and murder not only against non Muslims, but even against themselves. If we looked at the violence and deaths only in the Islamic world, the difference is overwhelming.

Saddam single-handedly killed more Muslims than anyone alive. He also treated his own people with such inhumanity that is rivaled by no other. Yet and still, he is held in such high esteem in the Muslim world and even haled as a hero to many of them.

The National Islamic Front in Sudan killed hundreds of thousands Muslims. They've also taken Islamic Slaves. The Armed Islamic Group in Algeria also killed hundreds of thousands within the last 10 years alone. In Chechnya, another 100 thousand killed and half the population displaced from their homes. The Taliban and Al Quaeda killed 10 of thousands of Shia. In Mauritania, tens of thousand of Muslims are held as slaves. Tens of thousands more died in the Kashmir conflict and in the civil wars in Liberia, Ivory Coast, and Sierra Leone. Thousands more have died in Nigeria and Indonesia. The Burmese junta drove out more than a quarter million of its Rohingya Muslims in the early 1990s. In India last year some 2,000 Muslims were slaughtered in Gujarat, some disemboweled or burned alive while police stood by or joined in.

Yet these events are passed over in silence, even within much of the Muslim world. Meanwhile, the perpetrators of many of these atrocities sit in the UN condemning events in the West Bank.

But why is there such an outcry among Arabs and Muslims concerning Israel and the Palestinians? Certainly one can say they indeed have a point in much of their argument about Palestinian treatment, but when we look at the Muslim world, own treatment of each other is staggering in comparison.

Please respond with your opinions freely, but let it be without the prejudices of Arab or Jew bashing.

Thank you for your time. Have at it!!!

"Since the days of the Prophet, there are only two forces on earth, Muslims and infidels. And their fight will go on until Judgment Day." That remark, from a Pakistani Muslim student, reminds me of the Marxist view that the world is divided into proletarians and capitalists. We're well aware of the destructive result of this doctrine. Unless Muslims can overcome the simplistic vision of the world as a place of two antagonistic realms, of believers and infidels, and embrace cultural diversity and religious tolerance, their relationship with the West will inevitably lead to conflict.

GEORG SCHWARZMANN
Columbia, S.C.

And we won't even mention how the U.S. wants to export , its take on Human rights Democracy and Capitalism ebverywhere and whereever it exports this view different cultral values seem to be expected to just disappear!

Mann you give me a lot to reply to!
ok first Islam is supposted to be a community (and a way of life) this was as Mohammad intended, so its no surprise muslims feel the need to stand up for one another when threatend. ( the Irony here is that Islam is as riven with splits as Christianity).
Muslims have codes of right and wrong and they have many sources of finding out what is right from wrong . there is the Quran and the Sharia, for example. There are also groups of learned muslims who try to interpret the Word of God . (This is necessary in a world were God last spoke 1500 years ago and a lot has happend since!) But lets be clear too Muslims do not always see the same rights and wrongs as those bought up with morals from a Christian tradition! They do have a different world view.
you say that muslims do not cry out at wrongs from otherr muslims to muslims, well there is a reason for this. Earplugs! The Westen mainstream media is far more concerned with the way it percieves muslims relate to the west than it does about how muslims relate to other muslims! can you be sure you are recieving the full picture about how muslims relate to muslims. Does CNN see its watchers interests as being in muslims relating to muslims? or as being in muslims relating to them? thiois doesn't agive you the reality.
There is another part to this problem too Most Muslim countries are ruled by despots Some of them supported by the West. What do Dictators like to do? Well control the media. (This is in contrast to the west where media control is entrusted to Media Moghuls). so where their media does report things its often skewed toward the Tyrants point of view. Natuarly if you are fighting a dictator its hard to do it peacefully. and many of the anti tyrant movements have linked up with muslim fundamentalists. this is because muslims see their morality in terms of Islam. America feels threatend by fundamentalists and supports the Dictators. Thus the view you get is skewed towards Dictators.
Saddam Hussein is not a hero to mst muslims many did support him for a while when he was being atacked by America ( lets be blunt this was wrong) but this was because they see themselves as being in an unequal fight with American 'cowards' who use high tech weapens against them. it was support largely for the underdog! Americans also have this desire to support the underdog! Hollywood makes tons of movies on this very theme.
To a fundamentalist Saddam Huessein is actually a worse criminal than Bush, the worst sin/crime in Islam is apostay abandoning the faith and Saddam was a non-secular ruler.
this explains why Osama and Saddam could never be close!
( Are you sure the slaying of muslims in Gujarat wasn't by Hindus?)
Yes muslims are not always good about condemning Muslim violence, neither is the West or America always good at upholding its principles. Becareful where you fling the first stone you might find it lands very close to home.
Israeli crimes are ignored or excused by concentrating on Arab ones. Meanwhile I get frequently told about how Israel is being held to a higher standard! Jikriv feels free to concentrate on Palestinian hatred of Israelis and ignores the idea that the very real topical issue of the Ethnic cleansing of the West Bank is freely promoted in Israel.
Let me leave the last word to a jew Are you sure you are not worrying about the speck of sawdust in someone elses eye, and ignoring the wooden board in your own?

If the Jews wanted ethnic cleansing then why don't they do it Dragon? Please tell me. They have the means, why don't they do it? If they wanted all palestenians dead, then why do they target hamas leaders instead of stadiums and schoolbusses?
"Ethnic cleansing of the WEst Bank is freely promoted" promoted by whom? The government? Show me a poll that says that Jews want all the palestenians dead. Show me an elected official that advocates this.
Your arguments just don't hold up, all you have is your biased hatred of Jews. You would defend the nazis if they were still around, you would say "Yes, we all know that the nazis want all jews killed, but come on, the jews must have done something to deserve such fanatical hatred right? I'm with the nazis!"
And speaking of "looking to thine own eye first," you are guilty of exactly what you are accusing people of. You despise Israel so much, that you don't see a problem with palestenians wanting to wipe them off the planet. Where does the hate come from dragon?

Truly you have a point about government controlled media in dictator countries Dragon. You also make a good point about media in the west bias in reporting its broadcast.

I am not blind to the fact that this happens, however clearly if you ask any Arab what is their biggest concern in the world today, Israel is either first or second on their list. Although media is controlled by dictatorships, surely one could not keep such a wide spread concentration of violence under wraps.

The information I posted here came from my own research, and even if it was the Hindus in Gujarat, you still hear nothing of this from the Muslim world, so maybe it's just bias against the West and Jews.

At any rate one cannot ignore these facts Dragon. If they do not share western views on morality, then why try appealing to it concerning Palestine? It appears hypocritical at best that they complain about what's taken place there and completely ignore other far worse atrocities. In the U.N. there's constant reference to Israel by Syria, the one Arab Council member.

But how can you accuse western media of bias when every Islamic journal online I read slams Israel at every chance they get. Instead of reporting the news, they are far worse by tainting it with their hatred of Israel. Some papers are better than others, and about 4 months ago I saw arabnews.com actually say that Muslims do not protest against other Muslim violence against themselves. It went on talking about Saddam and his atrocities and how the Muslim world says nothing about it. They happen to report the news with less Israel bashing than other Journals, but they do it still the same.

Last but not least, I think your opinion is tainted, though I haven't gotten the perception that you hate the Jews, I get the perception that you think they are wrong in everything they do, even when defending themselves.

Israel doesn't in my opinion want genocide. That is another spin put on the conflict by the Arab world. However I do believe they want the land. But how do you speak evil and protest this and nothing is said or brought up in the U.N. from Arabs about the last 10 years in Bangladesh? You speak of the Palestinian refugees but nothing of the Rohingya refugees.

And you can't see my point?

I was all set up to reburke Jirkiv for another misrepresentation of my postion, and I find you doin g the same thing, One. If you both get the same idea it can't be you that is wrong it must be me. When I used the term 'ethnic cleansing' I did not mean genocide I meant they were aiming to clear out Palestinians over time from the West Bank It seems the term I used was misleading, and I will try to use others in future.
If I have not made myself clear on Israel I will try again I don't oppose Israels right to defend itself. But I do think that iits easy to be sceptical about the idea that they are simply defending themselves in occupying the West Bank. While we agree that arabs are hostile to Israel you have yet to show that there is any real threat. Even suicide bombers do very limited actual damage. I continue to belive that there is a good chance that direct negociations based on the recognition that Israel has been denying Palestinian Human Rights is the best sourse of future peace for Israel. But I don't see Sharon doing this.
Actually I fully agree with you that arabs (generally, excepting Palestinians) are too obsessed about Isreal For many Arabs Israel is the 'proof' that the West is out to get Arabs ( along with some anti arab attitudes) It's hard to tell someone that they are being paranoid when they can point to the peorson who is out to get them. My solution to this problem ( what me a monomanic?) is to solve Isreal/Palestine. It will at least get the problem out of the headlines, and maybe Arabs will concentrate on their real problems. I also admit that their problems will take a lot more work than a Palestinian state ( actually I'm agreeing with you here)
You say I accuse the westen media of bias when the muslim media is the same well The Westen media is biased, (I'm right) and muslim media is biased too (you're right!) the 2 don't cancel each other out. I'd love to see more diverse media promoted in the west and in Islam! its easier for me to be more critiacal of the westen media
I live here.
Maybe too there is a muslim inferiorty complex which stops them examing muslim problems.
I should make a point about the U.N.
As I understand it the U.N. was designed mainlt to resolve conflicts between Nations and maybe to reduce colonialism. Issues aabout the way countries are governed tend to be a slightly different issue. Yes I know this is hypocritical but the hypocracy isn't mine, its a world wide attitude . and I think there is good reason why intercountry government issues have to be treated differently. For this reason the U.S. will not be allowed to govern Iraq for long even if its Government is clearly better than Saddams. and it may be replaced by a Government that is in Human Rights terms worse than the U.S. That doesn't mean I don't support good human rights for Iraqis. Iraqis have to sojve the problems of government in a way that suits Iraqis. This just meansthat the ways of dealing with some problems have to be different from the way similar problems are sometimes dealt with. and yes I support this, along with most of the rest of the World. I'm aware of its flaws but I can see no better alternative. Concentrating on Arab misgovernment won't get Israel out of Palestine. (but that doesn't mean forgetting Arab misgovernment either.)
I think Bangladesh is stretching a point about Arabs but if I disagree with your facts that doesn't mean I disagree with your arguments. my main aim was to increase your understanding of where Arabs are comming from.
Finally I'm not saying Muslims aren't and can't be affected by westen moral views. But I am saying That Mohammad had a different moral view than Christians and the Jews, and a lot of writers to this site have no problem misrepresenting Muslim morality based entirely on ignorance misrepresentation and Christian views.

If I may have misrepresented your position, I'm sorry. Certainly I don't want to debate a point that really isn't a point at all, it's pointless.

I can't help be notice that your opinion is leaning towards Arabs and Palestine. If you happen to be from that region, then I certainly understand. What I don't understand is how you think suicide bombing isn't a "threat" to Israel. Absolutely it is as its chief purpose is to terrorize. Who wants to live under siege in their own country?

Another thing Dragon is how do you see that Bangladesh is different from Palestine refugees? Surely the Arab and Muslim world wouldn't say that if it were Israel or the US displacing them from their homes.

The UN is good in its idea, but politics can play big in the UN as well as on the government level. I think the US tries to influence the UN constantly. They carry a lot of weight and seek to use it to their advantage. However they aren't much different than many other nations there. Syria is always trying to pass legislation aimed at condemning Israel at every turn. Secondly the Arab world refuses to condemn the suicide bombings anywhere. Did you happen to see the bombings in Iraq today? They bombed the Red Cross building there. Tell me how this is justifiable? Is it because the US is occupying the land?

They Arab world has a very destructive mind set if you ask me. Either do what I want you to, or we'll bomb you. In my opinion it's sickening.

As for Palestinians, most of them see no wrong in the bombings. I'm sure if they did have a state of their own, they would still condone the violence.

There could be peace, but I just don't get the picture as they paint it. Like they're the victims and Israel is the oppressor simply out of hate for them. They made their degradation of their circumstances worse for themselves if you ask me. Not without the support of their neighbors of course.

On Monday, October 27 2003, a suicide bomber bombed a red cross building killing 26 Iraqis, 10 Iraqi police, and 1 U.S. soldier.

Below is a link showing the Arab world's response to what has taken place over in Iraq.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...iraq_arabs_dc_4

How ridiculous is this link?

http://www.latimes.com/news/printed...-news-a_section

So far, I think my position when starting this thread is holding up.

The link seems to be for registered users. I didn't look too hard into it however. Could be a simple solution. I just didn't care to jump through any hoops for the LA times. And yes, you are right on, concerning this subject. You post everything I am thinking but you put it to paper much better than I ever could. Good Job
I will just sit back and wonder how you can be so right on one issue but so wrong on another . How's that for a poke?

Its a trip to see you guys talk about the middle east, its really entertaining.

Its like looking at Mice trying to find cheese.

Little mice who have the television as a brain.

Is this coming from a Muslim who has no idea what the Hadiths are??????? Thought so!
How 'bout answering my post in the other thread. Or are you STILL waiting for your friends answer as you told us? Where is YOUR brain? Can you think on your own? I can't believe you would say that about someone( Little mice who have the television as a brain), after you admitted that you can't think on your own! Hilarious.

He brings Islam in it, wow, Politics and Religion dont go together, sport!

Sure they don't.

I only want to add one thing to One's remarks.

It isn't only the Arab world that has an unhealthy obsession with Israel. It is in fact the entire world media.

http://www.honestreporting.com/arti...g_of_Israel.asp

This article links to a primary source study.

Relevant clip:

"With over 900 articles on this conflict emerging on an average day from English-language media outlets, Israel ― a tiny nation the size of the state of New Jersey ― receives approximately 75 times more coverage than other areas of equal population. In comparison to other nations involved in armed conflict (where world media attention increases), Israel receives over 10 times more coverage by population. "

- woolfe

Tell that to one of your hero organizations Hamas. Tell that to the one's screaming "God is great" while beheading another individual (who happened to be Jewish) in Iraq.

What do you mean I bring Islam into it? I think you need to do some reading on the ideologies of your future Alumni.

Hey brainless, that wasnt Al'Qeada who beheaded Nick Berg, i have facts to prove it.

Yet another was beheaded in Saudi Arabia in the last day or so( don't know the details). I don't care what organization did it. I promise you this, though; They were Muslims, and the victim was an American or Jew. And you better believe that they know exactly where it is written (by God) that tells them to do precisely that. And you better believe that they were yelling Allahu Akbar( allah is greatest) while doing it. Still think Politics and religion don't mix or go together?

DevilDog wake up and stop lying to the people in the board, continue if you want, im just ignoring you, go ahead and keep on what your doing, because whats waiting for you in Hell is not pretty.

I feel the same way as Yahweh concerning false prophets. I doubt I go to hell for exposing one.
And since you have yet to prove anything I have said to be in err, perhaps you can start now. Where is the lie in my post? You want the scriptures AGAIN that tell Muslims to Behead, and or smite at the neck and all joints. How bout the one where it tells of Mo beheading hundreds on a single day. OOOHHH i bet ya didn't know about that, did ya? Sure is a peaceful religion.

Im not going to read your crap, so the only ones that you are fooling are the Zionists in this board.

Everyone with a level head= Zionist